Ben-DutkaIn response to the terrible Newtown, CT shooting, the National Rifle Association went after just about every major form of media entertainment, especially video games .
Such a stance has generated a wide variety of responses, and not just within the gaming community. California Senator Leland Yee has commented on the NRA's response at his website , saying quite clearly that he has little respect for the NRA vice president's reaction:
"I find it mind-boggling that the NRA suddenly cares about the harmful effects of ultra-violent video games. When our law was before the Supreme Court – while several states, medical organizations, and child advocates submitted briefs in support of California’s efforts – the NRA was completely silent. Now, rather than face reality and be part of the solution to the widespread proliferation of assault weapons in America, they attempt to pass the buck. More guns are not the answer to protecting our children, as evident by the fact that armed guards weren’t enough to stop the tragedy at Columbine High School. The NRA’s response is pathetic and completely unacceptable."
Obviously, your response will differ depending on your stance on gun control. I respectfully decline to comment on the issue, as I've seen enough not-so-friendly debate already. If you must discuss this in all its complex, combustible glory, please do so in a relatively civil fashion.
Yeah it's not worth arguing over, there's no one solution to the problem and people just get way off track while establishing their stance. Fort Hood was a freakin' military base! Anything done needs to be smart and multifaceted.
I've got it, we have the right to bear arms right? Outlaw bullets 😉
lol!
then the amendment would have to change to "bare arms"
I prefer to live in dangerous liberty than safe slavery. This is definitely an argument that should be handled without bias. My children deserve to be protected, and if a bad guy with a gun comes near my children… he will die. I dont condone the NRA blaming video games, but I would much rather lose my games than my ability to protect myself. America's 2nd amendment right is not about protecting itself from criminals as much as its about preserving freedom. Where in the media do you see that China just had a mass murder of 22 people from a man with just a knife? Whould we outlaw kitchen knives and every plausible weapon to protect ourselves, or should we be prepared for the mentally deranged? Taking my guns from me is not going to help the saftey of my children, and I am sad to call myself a gamer if my fellow gamers feel I should be unarmed when danger rears it's ugly head.
Nobody died in china though. Nobody, 7 were hospitalized unlike here where they were all shot. Also unlike the states, china has a policy against sensationalism in the news about killers.
I prefer safe liberty. 😉
Your China stats aren't accurate. No one died.
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/24/2012 11:53:19 AM
So everyone in the UK are slaves?
Do people in the UK have the freedom to protect their own life from someone with a gun? So, yes the UK citizens are slaves. Slavery has many different forms. In America, most of us are corporate slaves. The problem in America isn't how easy it is to get a gun, but how hard it is for the good people to carry a gun with them for protection. This is a rare moment in history when people don't carry protection on themselves. The masses are brainwashed to be scared of an item that can save lives.
Sounds like you're a slave to the need for firearms.
"Firearms stand next in importance to the constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence … from the hour the Pilgrims landed to the present day, events, occurences and tendencies prove that to ensure peace security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable … the very atmosphere of firearms anywhere restrains evil interference — they deserve a place of honor with all that's good."
George Washington
When you successfully thwart the take over of an oppressive government with the greatest military in the world, and continue to build the greatest republic in the history of the world, then I will believe that I am a slave to guns… until then, I thank my God that you didn't found my country. Good day.
Oh, and there is no such thing as "safe liberty"… If you prefer that someone else protect you (i.e. your government), then you are reliant on them and in essence become their slave. Few people understand the true identity of slavery, we all look to slave-labor as used hundreds of years ago as the only form of slavery, it is ignorant and dangerous to think this way. Remember this truth, if Americans lose their right to guns… billions of people will starve through the swift demise of American sovereignity and global take-over by bankers and elitists. You don't have to believe me, we may see this in our lifetime. I mean only peace my brother, you may classify me as a "gun nut", but I have children, and I will do absolutely anything to ensure that they remain free. Whether that is dying by the gun, or attempting to teach a portion of the masses HOW to think, when their entire life they have been taught WHAT to think. I mean no harsh argument to you as an individual, but I'm tired of other people deciding what is good for me. If you don't like guns, then don't own them, I will pray for the safety of your children if you have any. However, I will never let another man cause me to defy the teachings of my Lord, who prefers that I find the most effect means to protect my family.
Lol, " However, I will never let another man cause me to defy the teachings of my Lord, who prefers that I find the most effect means to protect my family."
What passage in the bible was that? I remember something about turning the other cheek and thought shalt not kill, and "forgive them father for they know not what they do" but I don't ever remember anything about stockpiling weapons just in case someone might attack you or your family…
I know that talk of religion is frowned upon, and that's all I'm going to say about it, but I think your view on what your Lord wants is a little skewed.
Last edited by CH1N00K on 12/25/2012 9:20:22 PM
Never mind, I found a verse that works for your logic..
"Blessed is The Peacemaker" although I don't think a Colt hand cannon is what Matthew had in mind, it could still work…
My apologies….
Last edited by CH1N00K on 12/26/2012 12:07:27 AM
No matter what side of the fence you sit on, or no matter which area of the grey area you exist within, every sane person knows the NRA's press conference was a joke. Video games, movies, media…
lol yeah, not the problem. Sure things in most countries still need improvement, but in all honesty, we've still come an extremely long way since before digital media began. I'm sure if you you could look at world violence before 1900 and world violence after 1900, you'd probably see we're less violent around the world. (Although, we have much more potent weaponry in missiles, etc.)
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/23/2012 10:46:15 PM
I don't know about that. I still sometimes don my animal hides and dust off the old battle ax to rape and pillage for no particular reason. It's like a 4D version of playing a Viking game. Oh shit, they're right, games have corrupted me ;(
Skyrim, perhaps?
I'm not even sure what game inspired it. I can't even think right now because I'm in such a video game induced rage.
Video games make me walk into peoples houses and break clay pots while I look for gems and hearts.
I wanna shake this man's hand.
Why there are so much focus in guns, video games and entertainment media? When a mass shooting like this happens, focus on the motive of the killer, in this tragedy it's clearly that he is mentally unstable, and his mother just didn't expect her son is capable of this horrible things and she happens to have guns. Just like a respected Colonel, who is known for being a good person suddenly snaps when he got released from his job and hostage a tourist bus and kill some of the tourist. And the truth is an armed security in school can really prevents crime, although they are not always going to succeed, and yes even those same security can snap as well but that why you have to really evaluate who's you're hiring. And owning a gun in a house is also a good self defense, a man shot two robber in his house, and the sad thing is that man is also questioned for such being brutal when he can shoot them in the legs instead. And those who are against in having security in school, it's like you don't trust every person who owns a gun, and I think you're more paranoid than those who have a gun for protections and self defense, and there is also sports concerning guns. My point is security in school can make a difference in case some suspicious lunatic shows up. And why are there more related crimes in America involving guns? There are a lot of factors like drugs, gangs, poor parenting and jobless hopeless depressed people. And in my country, above 90% of guns used in crimes is illegal, cause despite of the strict gun controls when people really is going to commit a crime they can aquire one thru black market and some metal fabricators can make one. And if some kid aciddentally shot his classmate thinking the gun in house is a toy, the media here don't blame guns, they blame the family for being such an irresponsible gun owner and also they reminds us to be more responsible and see it as a lesson, we don't focus on how many guns. In the end people are capable of this things and it's not a bad thing to be prepared and also is not a bad thing to be a gun enthusiast, some people do like to collect it just like some people that collects samurai, just be responsible. And if some flaw on how easy it is to acquired guns in America then review it. And remember the sarin gas attacks in Japan, it is a reminder that if a person is really a wacko they will find a way to do their horrible acts without a gun.
What's your country, out of curiosity? Also, do you have a rationale for why your country has such incredibly lower rates to the US? I'm still struggling to figure out why they're such a 1st world outlier.
I live in Canada, which is the second worst 1st world country for gun violence. We've had some shootings in Ontario this year, although none mass shootings. Almost all were gang related, and almost all were with weaponry smuggled in from the US.
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/24/2012 1:30:55 AM
How can this effect the future of games?
hes got a point though.
dont say boo till they have a chance to heap the sh*t on everyone else, than suddenly somehow hes found his tongue.
all ill say though is countries need to get FAR stricter than what they are!
i still cant believe you need to be 21 to vote and drink, but only 18 to own a gun.
give me a drunk guy, or a pissed off voter, over a gun owner any day of the week!
a bottle of vodka, or a pen, is more dangerous than a gun is it?
i cant understand why people need to own guns anyway, it should be illegal to own a weapon simple as that!
obviously thats not going to solve the situation, people will still find ways to get around it.
but at least thats just 1 extra way for the cops to hunt you down.
another thing, instead of looking to what these people were doing for their free time, how about we start looking at what was done to them?
i bet if they were to take all these nutters and delve into their history you would find they were abused as a kid.
maybe, just maybe that was what set them off instead of the games?
i remember a kid i use to go to school with, he was always copping sh*t from other students and even the teachers were constantly pouring sh*t on him because they just assumed he was lazy and did not care about school.
he ended up joining the bikies, and yup hes now spending the rest of his life in jail.
so who do we blame, the games, or the incompetent teachers who did not give a royal f*ck about what was happening to their responsibilities?
maybe its about f*cking time teachers and principles started looking after their students, and maybe, just maybe if everyone was happy at school, maybe this will stop happening!
stop trying to look for scapegoats for your lazy incompetent negligence!
Underdog,
Sorry if I can't reply properly, I'm using a cellphone. Philippines is my country, and although we have strict policy in owning a gun, if you have money and connections you can, even machine guns if you want to. And sadly to say we're one of the top or 10, I'm not sure, in media killings. Have you heard about the Maguindanao Massacre? But we don't focus the blame on guns and responsible gun owners. We blame the master mind and his political motive and the Police and Military stationed there in their incompetence to their job right. And we also have gangs and their gang wars. We also have violence in school, that's why we have security guards. A girl stabbing her classmate inside the room or a father of a bully pointing a gun point blank on the enemy of his inside the Principal's Office. But we all know that the gun is not to blame, the blame is on the guards in the school who is again incompetent on his job and course the culprit, he's a wacko. And all the Police can do is investigate if the gun is legal and if it is, his permit to own a gun will be revoke and some jail time for his stupidity. And sometime ago, a family who tought the are safe living in a secure subdivision because there were no crimes reported in there until they leave their only daughter alone and when they returned she was murdered, it's heart braking. As long as their is drugs, gangs, poor parenting, depressed people etc… involved, things like this will going to happen even if you're in a first world country. And I thought US have learn their lesson from the Columbine Shooting to put more strict policy in owning a gun and some security guards in school. But the media focused the blame on legitimate gun owners on their right to protect themselves and their families, on the video games and not on the parents who is irresponsible to let their kids play matured video games and movies.
This is because the focus is on the only constitution that has stopped the global takeover of freedom. Without the American constitution, the global bankers own everything, and why focus on mass murders in a country they already control? I am an American and I have gladly lost friends over this fact. Im amazed that we are only 70 years past the last time America enslaved their own people before we are calling out to enslave them again… I'm sorry but SLAVES don't own guns, only FREE people own guns.
Columbine had an armed deputy on site. And fort hood was a military base. Clearly the debate isn't a simple one as in those cases, guns couldn't protect poop.
Armed security guards will give you more chance on defending against crimes in school, I didn't say they will always prevail. But still it can make a difference. And arming teacher is a stupid idea, they are trained to teach not to handle bad guys in guns, maybe some, but they are most of the time inside the classrooms. And in the wake of the 911 terrorist attack, what did authorities have to done to prevent this, they tighten airport security. Weapons can save lives, and
I'm not singing the praises of some idiotic senator just because he called out the NRA for saying something stupid. California tried to ban some of the videogames on the market, so how is this flake all of a sudden some kind of hero.
California can send all their gun owners and gamers to my home state or ban the people that want to ban guns.
Gun haters could leave the country and solve the issue once and for all.
He was actually one of the main guys trying to ban videogames. He still wants to but not in the way the NRA wants to. I kind of found it funny that he is criticizing the NRA when he's trying to ban violent videogames.
Crime skyrocketed back in the sixties because they let one atheist woman get her way when they banned God and prayer from our school systems.
No God, no guns, and no hope for America. Let's ban everything that can offer some sense of peace and security. I think Americans are getting exactly what they asked for. A nation adrift and lost.
Aren't you aware tes, it's only ok to turn to god AFTER the tragedy.
There's really no true way to "resolve" this issue. The only way to attempt to "contain" it is by forcing owners to attend classes and require them to re-register their fire arm once a year or two years similar to a vehicle. As a owner I don't think that would be much to ask. You can't blame the weapons and I honestly don't feel that you can blame mental illness.
What about us just having pistols just to protect our love ones and leaving the more powerful weapons to the trained army, police/swat team, etc.
Last edited by AcHiLLiA on 12/24/2012 11:54:45 AM
That makes sense to me.
I'm glad our forefathers didn't think like that. Ever consider that someday you may have to protect yourself from those same groups.
You mean like a standoff? Yes, guns always work in standoffs for the people that aren't police. ;p
And no. I don't think I need to protect myself from the police. lmao. How very paranoid!
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/24/2012 3:28:44 PM
give powerful weapons to the police no way u insane give us powerful weapons and let the cops have pistols.
Last edited by sinister nero on 12/24/2012 4:04:29 PM
Hmmm… *many countless situations pop into head where that would lead to disaster*
Yeah, no.
Also, in most cases the cops are the ones with just pistols, according to my research. Only special task forces have anything different.
I think you should have all guns available at the time of the second amendment's instatement available to you. So grab your muskets and breech-loaders people!
You even get a bronze trophy for stabbing someone with a bayonette, then shooting a second person through the stabbed person! (AC3 reference)
oh… my… goodness… what's happening to me! Video games really ARE tricking me into violence!
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/24/2012 3:30:28 PM
No matter which side you're on (regardless of the issue), simple scapegoating w/o a factual basis (NOTE: generalizations and coincidences DO NOT count as supporting facts) is nothing but foolishness.
Tis' my point. Still wish someone could tell me why the US is so violent compared to the rest of the first world. :p
So far, all I've been told is that I -might- have to protect my family, I should equip elementary schools with weapons, since the forefathers from the late 1700's told me I can keep my musket that I am therefore allowed to hold any assault rifle I desire and conceal it (isn't letting everyone know I'm packing heat a more effective preventative measure, by the way?), I might need to protect myself against my own military and police forces, and that if I DO happen to have a gun, and I go near someone's kid, I'm going to die.
It's a very confusing situation for me! lol. I'm not even asking about guns, per se. Just wanting to know why the US is that much more homicidal. I mean, many swear guns aren't the issue. That's fine. I can deal with that. But still… no one's been able to answer my question. Heck, if someone can answer it with factual information, I'll completely recant what I say and admit I'm wrong!
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/24/2012 3:36:34 PM
Very true underdog. I'm from the states and I can't answer your question as to why people think this way. I've agreed with all of your reasoning. I wish others would too.
Yeah. Well, I'm going to go ahead and take the "W" on this topic. I'm glad you're here to join me, and it sounds like a few others are as well. (American's, in fact, to all you "outsiders don't get to have opinions" people.) No one in this thread or in any thread from the last 2 articles has been able to do what I ask. I won't lie, though. It was rigged. I knew they wouldn't have an answer unless they agreed with me. That's how positive I am that I'm right on this topic.
You and every American I know in person are on the same page.
P.s. A few American heroes were murdered today while responding to a fire. And I heard on the news about a guy that was apprehended who had planned on attacking another school. A very smart citizen stopped him… by alerting the authorities when they caught wind of it. Guns were not required.
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/25/2012 1:42:12 AM
What I don't get is why everyone seems to think the debate and political changes that will take place in January mean things will either end up completely on one side or the other of the issue. Clearly it's far too late for an all out ban to take place. It's impossible to do. The discussion will no doubt be about how to control who has access. Personally, I feel that at the very least, a psychological assessment be mandatory for gun owners, criminal records checks should be done every couple years, and a registry (one more efficient than Canada's money gobbler) be required. High powered assault rifles should be kept by licensed gaming establishments only to limit them being available to the public.
This way, upstanding and sane citizens would still have access to weapons for "protection", your second amendment would still be valid, and although I doubt you can truly stop every homicide from happening, I bet you would at least see a decline in instances. You can limit national cost by requiring minor fees be paid for annual registry of weapons. Heck, if managed correctly, it may even allow the government to MAKE income to help heal the national debt (albeit only a little bit).
Obviously, it would be more difficult than just that, but I believe there is a way to allow people to keep their weapons while placing better restrictions.
Pretty soon, all firemen will need to be accompanied by police….
I think they should follow china's policy for it. They must pass both a psychological test and a firearm proficiency test by shooting at targets. They take a test every 3 years to make sure they are able to wield the firearm and remove it if you fail. Of course, the country is under communist rule but even they have better gun laws than my home country.
Here's a metaphor for the way I see it:
Let's pretend that everybody in the USA could have a red button in their house that would launch a nuke.
Even though nobody really needs to be able to launch a nuke, the Constitution doesn't specifically prevent it and therefore anyone who wants one can get one.
When one person suggests outlawing nukes to prevent a nuclear holocaust, a red-button owner counters by saying, "No sane person would ever actually press the red button. Instead of taking away our red buttons and violating our freedom, let's combat mental illness and violence in the media so that nobody ever wants to push the button."
But no matter what we do, if everyone has a red button, somebody will eventually push the button. And it won't matter why they did it, if it was an accident or on purpose, or if they were criminally insane. The button got pushed.
Well thats a nice thought but before long the only one with nukes will be Iran N.Korea Russia because our president is disarming our nuclear stock pile. Very smart, so disarm the people while you're at it cause their all just a bunch of sheep and will fall in line for the slaughter.
hoo boy, verdin. I think you missed his point. You owning a gun in your house isn't protecting you from Russia nor is it what you need to protect yourself from Russia… (I don't see your connection…)
Last edited by Underdog15 on 12/25/2012 1:37:10 AM