Ben-DutkaIt really is this simple.
I don't think enough people understand exactly why legions of fans are denouncing Lightning Returns: Final Fantasy XIII . They don't understand because they look at it and go, "Hm, could be pretty good." And they can't grasp the sheer amount of hate and vitriol spewed in its direction. After all, the game doesn't appear to be terrible.
But Square Enix calls it a Final Fantasy game. That's it. That's the whole reason, right there. Turn Lightning Returns into a new IP with a new name and a new protagonist and even I think I'd be interested. See, you may notice that most Metal Gear Solid fans have no problem with Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance . They did at first, but then it was clarified that it was a spin-off , and that a title true to the franchise's roots was on the way ( Metal Gear Solid: Ground Zeroes ). If Square Enix had done the same thing; if Lightning Returns had just been a spin-off and Final Fantasy Versus XIII or Final Fantasy XV could actually be counted on to be the FINAL FANTASY we've all known and loved, the fans would be fine.
I would be, too. This really has absolutely nothing to do with the potential quality of the game in question. It has everything to do with the fact that it most certainly is not a Final Fantasy production. At least, not in the eyes of the long-time fans, which apparently don't amount to a hill of beans in Square Enix's eyes, anyway. I've always understood – and even supported – the drive to get new fans. It's how companies stay alive. But I've never understood the concept of ditching old fans to get those new fans…then what's the point? Just because you think the new fan base is larger? If you want to make spin-offs and try to cater to the twitch gamers and casual gamers, fine. Go for it. By all means. But to annihilate your flagship franchise to do so? What sense does that make?
Seriously, just call it something else, Square Enix. Give it a new name. Tell us it's not Final Fantasy . I promise that the vast majority of people would get off your back…provided you didn't do it all over again with the next game with "Final Fantasy" in the title.
Nail on the head. People say hey it's a spinoff don't worry but that's not the truth of it. The truth is that this company has no intention of ever returning this franchise to its core principles and continues to prove this in such a way as to both demean and humiliate their entire fanbase.
There is no substantive, solid, reliable fantastic franchise (many would argue the greatest ever made) to fall back on in the light of these tasteless games that don't seem to be being made FOR anybody. Have you ever met a FF fan that asked for the changes that began with XIII and keep going on? Have you ever met a mainstream action fan who wished FF would change so they could play it?
Didn't think so.
Last edited by WorldEndsWithMe on 12/21/2012 11:28:01 PM
I love games like NG and enjoy others like Bayonetta and GoW. I was beginning to think Lighting Returns would be something similar. Instead, it just looks nothing like those games, but looks like a really REALLY weak Assassin's Creed, in the exploration PARKOR department, with a solo-played FFXIII style combat system.
I remember being bothered that FFXI was named what it was and NOT FF Online. I'm okay with Final Fantasy being used similarly to like Tom Clancy's lineup of offerings, but S-E had BETTER keep serving the main dish to the core players of the franchise. I was annoyed that FFXI's existence stalled the release of the next more traditional FF offering. I did snag FFXII soon after it's release and played it straight through, and was quite satisfied with it other than it's extremely heavy grinding balance …and the story never really seemed to hit a solid high with any particular character. Oddly enough Vaan's pertinence to the plot line sort of faded into the rest of the political-goings on. Anyway, S-E seems to have forgotten their core. I bet more FF ardent fans would be more accepting of this Lighting Returns game IF only S-E had been consistently serving up core offerings of the series. We're like 7 years into this gen with only ONE FF game that attempts to pass the mustard as a FF, but left a lot to be desired by stalwart fans. S-E just isn't serving everyone's favorite dish anymore it would seem.
Last edited by Temjin001 on 12/21/2012 11:59:43 PM
I feel it is my obligation to help you my friend and please don't take this as annoying quip. We would say it doesn't "pass muster".
Or cut the mustard…
Thanks guys 😉
Now I just need to mustard up the strength and hit the gym this morning =p
I have conflicting arguments going on in my head right now. As a long time FF fan I do agree with you Ben. I mean, it's all about legacy. But then I can't help but think that if legions of fans are upset with a quality production (if that's what it ends up being) based on a name, then how trite are we?
Just make the game good, that's all I want from SE.
A flower by any other name, will still smell just as sweet.
Last edited by SaiyanSenpai on 12/22/2012 1:32:42 AM
If this thing is quality I'll eat my hat.
haha! Nice one World.
I don't know why, but I still find myself cautiously hopeful with each FF release. After all these years…my childhood just won't let me lose hope.
*sigh*
Lol I don't know if all of you can see it but there's an ad to the top right of this page of Lighting Returns: Final Fantasy XIII mocking us… it says "it's the last game you'll ever play"…
I'm sorry but I gotta do a half quote of The Hangover…
It's funny 'cause it thinks it's a Final Fantasy!
It's the last game you will ever play because after you play it you will loose all hope in everything that is great in gaming.
HUGE background advertisement for LR:FFXIII and here is an article declaiming it. The irony, but I know that Ben doesn't choose what ads to run. I may not have the storied history with FF that you guys do, but I get where you're coming from. I'd be pissed too if something that I love was unrecognisably altered from what was successful before.
My problem is that this very clearly has no idea what it wants to be. It's an A-JRPG that still doesn't give you direct character control in combat. How does that make any sense whatsoever?
Maybe they should just call it Lightning Returns: Fabula Crystallis Nova? Surely that would make everyone happy? But then, it seems that the whole FCN idea was thrown away when Type-0 dropped the Agito XIII label. I just don't like that they're trying to annualise the series and to pad it out with abominable spin-offs like Theatrhythm or whatever the deuce it's called? Bonkers man.
aye, about the Lighting Returns BG advertisement.
Is it just me, or does this game during battle seem even more graphically…. set back? It's like a regression with each title.
With XIII-2 they had to make the PS3 and 360 versions comparable. I'm guessing when you sweep up the scraps of that game and try to squeeze a time-trial game out of said scraps you get some underdeveloped stuff as a result.
they will still complain, they will say why is $E wasting their time with this when versus was announced 6 freaking years ago and we still have next to no info on it!
Actually I still have a problem with Metal Gear Rising, I loved the idea of c spin off with Raiden set before MGS2 & MGS4. Because Raiden had a story to tell within that period. Ever since Revengeance it has became splinter in my mind. Raiden earnt his peace at the end of MGS4 and setting a tragedy after that just seems wrong.
In my opinion Lightning Returns suffers in the same way, it is not the game it should be. This is no mere spin off, this is the conclusion to the series. So to have it turn into an action game when the previous games have been RPG's creates a problem – It simply doesn't live up to what a Final Fantasy XIII-3 should be. This is not a spin off like Crisis Core a mere side project created just to explore a characters story – FXIII:LR is continuing the main story after XIII-2.
I like Final Fantasy enough to forgive SE but only if they make it a proper rpg again. So far this gen, they save me $60 every time they release a FF game. I'd rather it be the other way around.
This article should make it abundantly clear why long time fans are upset with SE.
so whose this 'Lightening' chick then?
looks like she doesn't have a rib cage
Perhaps everyone should reserve judgement until they play the game.
Now while I understand the anguish over the changes to the game you love (it happened to me with Ace Combat Assualt Horizon), but you should at least give it a chance.
The old saying "don't judge a book by its cover" might just apply here!
I wasn't very happy with what they did to Ace Combat either. I always looked forward to playing that franchise and they ruined it with the last installment. We waited for Bill Gates to get his fill and PS3 owners were rewarded with a steaming pile of crap for their patience.
Indeed tes37. Ace Combat to me has always been about replaying the missions and earning "Ace" status.
With the forced DFM, I was left very unhappy that I couldn't just fly in each mission and shoot down all the targets as fast I could.
AC:AH marks the first Ace Combat that I failed to get the "Ace" rank in all missions which is a bummer since I really enjoyed the rest the of what the game brought.
I liked FFXIII and I might buy this game used because of the bad aftertaste XIII-2 left, but after seeing this, I will not play this game, maybe I will if they will give me one for free. Just look at the combat system, it's pitiful for being an action rpg game, and what the hell is that climbing off a ladder, Lightning don't use ladders, she jumps off them. And that freaking costume, even Cosplayers don't want to wear that piece of crap.
I just dont understand why they keep wanting people to love the world of ff13 and this character.
To this date lightning is my most hated FF character. Her dialogue is cringe worthy and she is just terribly unlikable and her attitude for most of the game is abysmal.
Why in the bloody heck did we get three of these? Most people hated the characters in FF13, thought that FF13-2 had a bad story and an unrealized combat system. So then Square is like..well maybe they will like this? It is like they are trying to force us to like this terrible character they created in a world that we have had enough of.
The worst part of it all is Versus 13 is a FREAKING ACTION RPG why not just release that? Versus was supposed to be the Action JRPG in the vein of Kingdom Hearts so why on earth did they decide we would want this instead?
The reason fans are pissed is because this game doesn't need to exist. It isn't a thank you from Square to the fans it is a kick to the nuts from them. The only purpose it serves is to try and get DmC, God of War, and possibly KH fans to buy it. It is purely a product made to make money. It is what is wrong with the industry, publishers trying to make a product that will sell only the worst/best part of this is, it probably wont sell crap.
I say worst because what a waste of time and resources and I say best because maybe that will wake SE up from whatever drug induced mega trip they have been on for the last 5 years.
Ugh the frustration mostly comes from me wanting versus so much. I can only say one thing and it would be the only way Square redeems themselves.
If by some miracle they are making all of these crap cash ins for the sole purpose of funding Versus I will totally be alright with that. However I don't know why versus isn't out after 6 years, maybe they are scared that it wont live up to the hype soooo they are making terrible games so that everyone can't help but love it…I swear if I lived in Japan I would go and try and talk to SE not violently just be like WTF why why why why who what when why and why.