Ben-DutkaFor me, backwards compatibility was one of the biggest selling points of the 60GB PlayStation 3. It really was.
But I've learned something over the course of this generation, and I've concluded that I really don't care if the next PlayStation has the same feature. I know, I have to explain, as most say b/c in the PS4 is incredibly important to them (and that's perfectly understandable).
Thing is, I've realized why I keep the PS2 hooked up. My current PS3 slim model doesn't play PS2 games and in truth, I don't like the way it emulates the PS1 titles (sound keeps cutting out in Castlevania: Symphony of the Night , damnit). I use my PS2 to play any and all PS2/PS1 games I feel like revisiting. And in looking at my PS3 collection the other day, something struck me: I really have no desire to play anything there again, with the lone exception of Heavy Rain .
It has absolutely nothing to do with quality. I think we can all agree that games like Uncharted 2: Among Thieves , Uncharted 3: Drake's Deception , God of War III , Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots , The Resistance and Killzone titles, and Gran Turismo 5 are all pretty great games. And right now, every single one is well worth playing at any time of day. But I've discovered the reason I go back and play the older games is surprisingly simple, and those who remember those titles will sympathize.
It's a two-part combination; equal parts nostalgia and a style of gameplay we don't have much anymore . When I go back to Final Fantasy VII , it's not only because I want to relive those glory days, it's also because consoles really don't have epic turn-based RPGs with world maps, now do they? That goes for a lot of my RPGs. And sure, you could say Grand Theft Auto: Vice City is all about nostalgia, but I think we all know that GTAIV went in a different direction in terms of gameplay style and atmosphere, and GTAV will likely be similar. That arcade-y crazy theme in VC? …may not see that again, and you'll never see the 80s theme again, either.
We're not really redefining gameplay anymore, so with only a few exceptions, I can't see going back to the PS3 games in the future. Why? Why would I play Uncharted 3 when I have Uncharted 4 ? Or Gran Turismo 5 when I have Gran Turismo 6 ? Or God of War III when I have God of War IV ? All the new versions of those games will be pretty similar gameplay-wise, and likely better in terms of technical advancement. I go back to old PS1 (some PS2) and SNES games because I just don't have that particular style of entertainment anymore.
Chances are, most any PS3 game I look back on will be under the shadow of what may be its superior PS4 counterpart. It's most of the reason I'm not going back to play many games at all this generation. The bottom line is that I only really want to have access to gameplay styles that have died out (or are dying out), and while you find that two generations back, I don't think any gameplay styles we see in the PS3 generation will "die out" when the PS4 comes around. At least, I don't think so.
No offense to you Ben, but what I don't understand is why people bother with this question at all. Not to start a huge debate n stuff, but I highly doubt that the PS4 is not going to support Blu-Rays. Otherwise Sony would have backed up Blu-Ray in the format war for nothing.
Reading a blu-ray and being programmed to run a certain game are two completely different things. The old PS3s didnt play PS2 games because they could read DVD's, they played them because they were programmed and had special parts to. If you're already aware of that then sorry, I probably just misread what you said.
Backward compatibility is not about the blu-ray drive, Prince Perry. It's about the software.
You can't run a iPhone app on an Android phone, because they are not compatible. If you understand? The PS4 will most definitely feature a blu-ray player, but just as definitely it will not be able to play ps3 games.
I see what you guys are saying. I guess I was just thinking of it differently. Continuing the use of Apple as an example, I was thinking of how an iPad 2 is capable of playing games developed for the iPad 1 and 2, but the iPad 1 cannot do the same. But I guess (in theory) Sony outclasses Apple and something like that can't really be compared seeing as Apple isn't very innovative 😐
Yeah that means the iPhone is backward compatible. That would be preferable also on the Playstation of course, but if the rumours about the change of architecture is true it just can't happen.
Last edited by Beamboom on 4/8/2012 4:09:18 AM
backward compatibilty on earlier ps3s was made by a specific chipset , because the ps2 games run in a different architecture than the ps3
they stopped making them because people found an exploit using that very same ps2 backwards comp. chipset to hack and run copied games on their ps3s
so sony decided to nip it in the bud early and dropped the 60 gig fattys with BC from the market
so it all depends on the architecture that ps4 uses, if its pretty similar , they can give us backward comp, if its a new type of architecture using new processors , then we might not get BC at all, not that it matters, i wouldnt mind keeping my ps3 , i still have my ps2 and my ps1 is in a box somewhere, if anything for nostalgia reasons
I want bc in the PS4 and I do view it as a high priority on my list. It's too bad the rumored spec for the PS4 won't allow for bc without some sort of added hardware to its base design.
Anyway, I love the old classics even if newer, more refined versions, exist. For me there's usually many reasons to revisit the older games: the art assets(visuals and sound), story, gameplay eccentricities (GoW2 is still better gameplay wise than GoW3), and the beloved classic nostalgia feel. I'm okay with the rare abnormalities that sometimes present themselves with newer hardware. It's way better than nothing at all and is something Im willing to pay extra for, and the PS3 did allow us to see our games through a digital output as an added perk. I'm still sore at Sony for having ditched the PS2 chips. I was misled to believe PS3 would be a bc machine. I sold my PS2 prior to my phat PS3 dieing. All that was on the market at the time was the PS3 slim. Whoa is me =
I'm with you, BC is a big issue for me when it comes to the ps4, I really hope it atleast plays ps1/ps2 titles this time around, if not, I honestly might just pass on it.
It might not be a big issue for some, but I keep multiple systems hooked up, and having to keep a ps2 and ps3 hooked up already bothers me, and I dont wanna unhook the NES, she's been apart of my life for so long! ^^ .
Temjin001, "GoW2 is still better gameplay wise than GoW3" absolute b****cks, that's not even an opinion you're just 100% wrong. GoW3 improved over 2 dramatically in the gameplay department http://limitlessunits.com/blog/2010/03/30/god-of-war-iii-combat-enhancements-and-additions/, anyone who says otherwise is an ill-informed troll; you have a picture of Ryu as your avatar so that makes your opinion invalid anyway because Ninja Gaiden sucks and you are of poor taste.
I kind of agree with the op because for e.g. God of War 3 is clearly the best in the series in every aspect imo and it's the most acclaimed + beloved + best-selling game in the genre of all time, but I'd still appreciate bc in the PS4 in-case I want to play through all the GoW games again in chronological order then move onto 4 or 5 on the PS4 which will almost definitely be even better but without bc I'd be missing the ability to remind myself of why I love God of War if I can't play them all again.
So yeah new games are always going to be better than old ones unless you're one of those people who can't take their rose-tinted glasses off and can't see that games now are much better than they ever were, but I'd still like the option to play all my PS3 games.
Last edited by JustThatGamer on 4/7/2012 9:03:50 AM
I think you need to calm down there angry man 😉
And Phoenix, I'm not a big stickler on it or nothing. I'd like BC in my newer systems but it's not even clasped to being a deal breaker for me. Chances are, I'll be owning every next gen console for the next gen. I need my games.
As for the PS2 while id like to have one again I don't want to haggle around with controller cords again, especially now that HDTV's have me sitting further away these days. Aside from some shinobi games the majority of what I want on PS2 has been remastered in HD for PS3. And after having an HD version there's no way I want to go back to old sd. Plus those remastered games usually have FPS boosts, like GoW Collection for one.
I suspect the newer x86 archectures for the coming gen will help to make bc a viable thing from there on out, as I suspect a scalable console cycle is on the horizon for us.
I thought God of War 3 featured the best combat in the series too but I don't think you're a troll Temji. 🙂
Yeah, when I get a chance I want to check out angry mans link. I should clarify that i preferred a the composition of GoW2 over 3. There were more adventure elements, more bosses and a more epic feeling quests as a whole. 2/3s in on GoW3 I felt it lost momentum, where GOw2 was straight awesomeness through and through 🙂
Well, to be honest, BC is only a part of the problem for me with this gen and possibly next. I honestly feel so out of touch with the games this gen, the glory days of the RPG seem long gone to me, and I feel adrift a sea of shooters and games trying to apeal to the FPS crowd!. I can see this trend continuing in the next gens, and I'm not sure I want a part of it anymore…
Sorry to hear Phoenix. But hey Skyrim is a glory game, winner of a butt load of goty awards. Dues Ex rocks the house too. There's also the Wii's new jRPGs The Last Story and Xenoblade. So chin up solider!
Yeah and if you look after your old consoles they will last for a while. That's what I plan on doing. Technology is changing rapidly.
Not to be a hater, but for the original 60gb PS3, you have to be really lucky as well, because I know I did everything to take good care of it especially after hearing reports of YLOD everywhere. In the end, it still met its end. I'm still pissed about it. I payed so much money for it.
If you're talking about the classic consoles, or Nintendo systems, then yeah, it can last quiet a bit. I think it's safe to say the PS3 slims are pretty reliable too (thank god).
What's funny about the 60GB PS3's is they were extremely reliable. They really didn't fail that often when you get down to it. You really wernt "lucky" that something didn't happen, you were more unlucky to have it happen. I'm victim of it my 60GB failed after 2 years. But I know people, that still have the original 60GB and they are running strong.
Something else thats funny; I also have a buddy who has a trick where everytime he gets the red light, he takes a hair dryer to it for a few min. On high, let's the internal components cool down and it starts right back up. This has gotten old for him and he's tired of backing stuff up every week, so he bought a slim recently, but it works for him.
Last edited by bigrailer19 on 4/7/2012 12:28:24 AM
i have a 1st gen PS3 60BG that i rarely even bother to turn off
the ONLY problem i had is some time my controlers don't sink
and to fix that is plug them it(has happend 3 times)
the PS3 is a tank
Sony should include backwards compatibility because people sell their old consoles, prices go down for the ps3,more people buy the ps3,and later want to move to the ps4.
There will be backlash no matter what Sony does.
Case In Point:
– Sony packs in almost everything in the 60GB PS3
"OMG It's too Expensive!"
– Sony strips down the PS3 to reduce cost
"OMG What about our PS2 games!?"
Backwards Compat isn't really high on my priorities. It's nice to have, but not really a dealbreaker to me.
How about having one with everything for a higher price and one stripped down for people with less of a budget.
Is it not that simple?
Exactly PAKINIPS, that's what Sony should've done. It would've been very easy to just keep a sku with backwards compatibility for a slightly higher price.
I understand that once you finish a game you don't feel like playing it again. But i don't, I keep on playing my PS1 and PS2 games. Gran Turismo 5 is amazing but I prefer Gran Turismo and GT3. Resident Evil,2,3,Code Veronica are better then the new Resident Evil. Playing all my video games in one console is priceless.
To this day, I still want to play PS2 games. I'm slow on keeping up with games so there are others that I want to catch up on. That said, games that I need to catch up for the PS3 is even more.
Unfortunately, the original 60gb PS3s weren't so reliable so it died on me, so there goes my PS2 games. I still have my PS2, but there's no way I'm able to squeeze that in on my current entertainment setup. It's too much clutter. Nowaydays, audio and video are connected through one cable (hdmi), and all my setup revolves around it. Now if you don't mind having to connect another piece of console, added with the PS3, it's gonna be a mess when you buy the PS4. When you buy TVs, DVD players, computers, etc., it eventually comes to the point where you won't be able to connect them all, and leave space only for the latest ones.
Other than that, I don't know… but to me, having the luxury to play all generations of Playstation games in one console is pretty nice to have, even if it's not a total necessity. I'll eventually have to accept fate and just rely on hd remakes or something.
There's a lot of PS2 games I missed out on as well, when at the time I didn't realize it. I was so into Socom and sports games, then came PoP and GoW that I didn't care about games like SoTC, or FF, or even the Kingdom Hearts games. But luckily for me some of those games I did miss out on (not just the few I mentioned) have showed as HD remakes!
Considering how you can pretty much get a PS2 for nothing now though, I don't think there's much reason to complain about no BC. You can get a PS2 for less than a new game.
That is a valid argument Big. It's just, at least in my case I don't want to have a pile of irregular sized boxes underneath my TV. It looks like a untidy mess and is a waste of space. To have everything to run on just one box is so incredibly much more practical.
Also, it kinda feels "wrong" coming from the PC world, to buy software that'll just work on my current machine, and with my next machine I'll start on scratch again. It feels… Wrong.
So I totally understand how backward compatibility would be preferable. It really would.
Last edited by Beamboom on 4/7/2012 6:20:29 AM
Yea it's not an argument any one will win haha. I dont want a mess of systems either, I want one that does it all. But I'll be fine either way, I've gotten along fin with out my PS2, mainly because as I pointed out the, HD remakes that were released! Although I would really like a KH game!
I agree with you Ben. The only PS2 games I've really gone back the play are Final Fantasy 12 and oddly enough, Downhill Domination. There aren't really anything like them in the curren Gen. I buy a new system to play the games made for that system. Not saying BC wouldn't be a feature that would be nice just to have, but it doesn't make or break whether I by a system or not. It it irritates me when people say they won't buy a Vita because it doesn't play ps1/ps2 games.
I don't care for BC, I really don't. But here's the thing the more I think about it. The PS4 will more than likely be a better console and entertainment system, no doubt. But the PS3 is pretty amazing and has come a very long way. I really don't want or need two consoles that really when you get down to it can do the same things. By that I mean, play Blu-rays, stream video, wi-fi, the PSN, etc…
So with that in mind I only need one of those consoles and it would be nice if it could play my PS3 games as I always go back to Uncharted Drakes Fortune, when I'm not playing anything else!
But you won't find me crying over it, or harassing Sony for not including it. In fact I'd rather the system be a little cheaper than have BC, because I will still have my PS3.
Speaking of Castlevania SotN I actually still have the Castlevania sampler CD that came with the original PSX game at launch. It has a bunch of the old school songs on it. I listened to it tonight while working UNIX command line crap.
Konami has always been great in the music department, especially when it comes to Castlevania.
Hey! Unix terminal commands is NOT crap! 😀
Last edited by Beamboom on 4/7/2012 10:56:32 AM
rm -rf ~/psxe/Beamboom
=p
jk
=)
sudo stfu
😉
As a collector I for one, have both, a 320 Slim(now 750) & a 60GB(now 1T) PS3, plus a Phat PS2 & a white PS2 Slim(and every one of them hooked up).
But, you know what??????
I still want all the options & gaming functionality that I can get on my console, so I definitely want to see BC put into the PS4!!!!!
Or….at least make a financially optioned SKU for a separate PS4 that has BC.
Just a few extra thoughts on this sit-rep……
Once BS is gone, and after the the prior console is no longer supported, your only option then basically boils down to buying another, is either buying a "used" console sight unseen, or getting completely "refurbed" model.
But….with buying a used machine sight onseen, you never know how it was treated & how long it will last.
Or that if it will even work at all after you've hooked it up.
The only one time I bought used(on eBay), it was a Intellivision-1 that also included 10 pictures that he took of it & it had looked like it was brand-spanking new from factory.
But after paying $110 for it, once I hooked it up, the red light come on(to show it powered up), but otherwise it was completely DOA on arrival & to this day, I can't still get it to work. The only reason I still own it, is that I hope to find someone who can repair it, and on the cheap since I've already got $110 invested into it.
Luckily for me, I had also found a Intellivision -2 around the same time, and that one does work, so at least I'm still able to play my ole time Burgertime, Stampede, Pitfall, games, etc.
So your only real option really whittles down to buying refurbs, which are fixed & also re-checked for any un-related problems, they are guaranteed to work, & they also come with some kind of "30 day, 90 days, & up to a 1 year" limited warranty.
Just make sure to check out the reputation of the refurb'er first before you buy.
Anyways, I have at least 9 retro consoles myself that are refurbs, and I've never experienced even 1 single problem from any one of them to this very day!!!! (KNOCK ON WOOD)
i agree with you Ben, well.. at least I did. I agree with you in respect of other consoles like from PS1 to PS2 and from PS2 to PS3.
but I did agree with Sonys statement only a few months ago where it said there was so much life left in the PS3 that there wouldn't be a PS4 any time soon, I was thankful for that.
when the PS3 came about I believe we had reached the end of the PS2, same with the PS1, although I believe that we had closed the book on PS2 more than when the PS1 ended, but my point is that personally I had reached that point where I was ready to move to another console, the only game I was playing at the time was FFXII and a handful of nostalgia. but thats ok, because we could always go back and play most of the games we loved.. it was fine.
I dont believe we are ready for a PS4, I dont think that I am ready for a PS4, but if it comes out I will buy one and im that sort of person that wont have two machines hooked up.. if i lived by myself and had all the space in the world, hell yeah.. I would have a 360 too.. but I dont. so as soon as a new console comes out I will change over.
(and here is the point of my post)
why should I invest my time in amazing titles coming up for them to be outdated by Xmas? if the rumors are true and GTAV isn't out by next year, that means I may have only ten months to enjoy possibly the best game on the system, what about DUST 514? that game is meant to last years, yet within 12 months of it coming out I may be looking at never playing it again, same with any other games that I could be looking forward to.. like maybe if that Fallout MMO was to ever come out or a Skyrim MMO, FFXIII VS, GT6, Tekken Vs Street Fighter.. the list is a big one.
I dont think im alone in my thoughts, I do believe that Sony could bring an emulator to the PS4 that will play these games, for the digital ones there could be a way of giving us a like for like versions on the PS4 if we have already paid for the PS3 one. .. that's if they couldn't do an emulator, which Im sure they could.
for the first time in a console I think B/C is really quite important if we are going to change over so soon, for the sake of a console war, for sales figures and just to get their foot in the door first or equally Sony will be damaging their fanbase, but I guess the risk to them is of less importance than being a year behind the competition.
I hope they sort something out. we really haven't seen the end of the PS3's life. the best most original games are usually made in the twilight years of a console, and here we are considering forgetting that and just going for a new powerhouse, where the devs will be concentrating on pushing it for the next five to eight years, its only when they are happy that they are not pushing it so hard that creativity comes out, I fear that the PS3 wont have this chance, well.. not fully anyway.
Last edited by dillonthebunny on 4/7/2012 1:35:39 AM
In theory it would be real neat to be able to play my ps3 games on the ps4, I would not mind being able to sell my ps3 when the ps4 arrives.
But with the change of architecture it's just so obvious that it can't be, and then it's ok.
Last edited by Beamboom on 4/7/2012 1:54:47 AM
Too many classics in the PS3 library. Sometimes it takes a while to realise a game is classic, but wait until the PS4 is here and you'll know. I KNOW I'll be playing LBP, MGS4, Uncharted, Killzone etc in the next generation – regardless if there's a newer version. Even now I still play LBP1, Uncharted1 and Killzone 2 as well as loads of 2007/8 titles. Okay maybe it's because I don't have money for newer titles but..w.e 😛
BC is nice and all, but ever since I bought my launch version PS3, I have rarely used it to play old games. I still do occasionally if there's one I really want to play within reach, but I usually just play the old PSX and PS2 games on my PC now since I don't have to worry about disc swapping and so forth.
Last edited by Geobaldi on 4/7/2012 3:07:15 AM
I really feel it needs to be there. However I don't want it in the standard model, I want it in an optional model. I don't care what the price point is either(seriously).
I want them to take into consideration that money is tight around the world(for the majority of people) and basically release the cheapest possible model, with quality in mind. And then sell from there own site a super high end, balls to the wall, every bell and whistle model for whatever price they want. I would be willing to buy 2. And if they sell it themselves they can cut costs by not having to build, ship, and store millions of them to retailers. Just custom make them as the orders come in, I wouldn't even mind if there was a delay or wait period because of high demand.
I have to disagree with Ben, et al. I think BC is vital for one simple reason: PSN games. I may not replay Uncharted or Mass Effect or Oblivion, but I've got dozens of PSN games on my hard drive that I'd prefer to keep playing on my PS4. And if Sony thinks I'm gonna rebuy PS1 classics in yet another format, they're crazy. 😀
However, if the Vita is any indication, I've no reason to worry.
Last edited by Fane1024 on 4/7/2012 4:47:47 AM
exactly my point! well said.
I suppose. I don't see why that would be a problem, though; you should just be able to re-download everything you bought from your download history. It's all attached to your Network account, anyway. The Network is the Network…I should like to think that those games will play on different platforms, like how some PS3 and Vita games operate now.
I'm afraid it's not that easy. If the issue were just to get the program downloaded to the new ps4 we would have had backward compatibility.
I guess it's best compared to trying to get an Android app to run on an iPhone by copying over the app via USB. It won't work. 🙂
Last edited by Beamboom on 4/7/2012 11:34:34 AM
@dillon
I probably only skimmed your comment, so full credit to you if you said it first.
@Ben
I would be fine with a modified version for PS4 if I didn't have to pay twice, but I doubt many developers would make the effort, so I'll keep hoping for full BC.
p.s. I meant to mention this, but forgot: I just hooked up my PS2 after at least 4 years (new shelf space), so I don't actually need my PS3's BC at the moment. That shelf space will most likely go to the PS4 when it arrives, though.
p.p.s. I actually had forgotten how to quit playing a PS2 game (i.e., just turn it off); I sat there for about a minute looking for a way to quit to the "XMB". 8{
it needs BC because how few games are out there that i want to replay there certainly are a few out there!
ME, R&C, infamous, AC, enslaved, batman and heavy rain for instance.
nintendo has always had BC.
M$ has always had BC.
so why cant $ony?
this is one of the reasons why people hate $ony so much this gen, and is exactly why they have been bleeding money ever since the ps3 released!
there constantly the most expensive out there but are also the ones with the least features!
thats one of the biggest things thats hurting them this gen, there charging for a Ferrari and giving you a Suzuki!
the ps3 for instance on release was a sh*t load more expensive then the wii and 360 but offered so so soooooooooooooooo much less!
so why am i paying so so sooooooooooooooo much more?
their TVs another example are NO WHERE NEAR the quality of panasonic or samsung or hell even toshiba!
yet there more expensive!
why?
or another example their vio notebooks.
when i was looking for a new laptop last year there was a special on vio notebooks trying to get rid of stock.
up to 20% discount on ALL vio notebooks!
i found one exactly the same spec, size, everything exactly the same as the asus i was looking at and it was 800 bucks MORE then my asus!
and thats with the vio being 20% off the asus was RRP as it just came out, and the vio was older stock.
the older, discounted laptop is 800 bucks MORE expensive then the brand spanking now RRP laptop.
how does that work?
i just cant understand how you can release a inferior, or exact same product and justify charging more for it!
so in other words $ony better have BC because everyone else will, and everyone else will be cheaper!
if $ony releases the ps4 without BC they can kiss a massive portion of their fan base goodbye!
Last edited by ___________ on 4/7/2012 5:26:25 AM
Hai thar, Mr. Pedantic 🙂
_________,
For your information the 360 is only semi-BC & won't play a lot of the original Xbox games.
M$ actually had to put out a listof which BC games could be played on the 360.