Ben-DutkaSo this girl gamer goes on NPR and demands respect . Well, she's entitled, I suppose. If there's any group that can understand being stereotyped, it's the gamers, especially those who grew up during the dawn of the industry.
But has anyone considered the possibility that while male gamers back in the day (when 99% of all gamers on earth were male) were automatically labeled in a certain way, girl gamers today face a new issue…? Well, it begins with the fact that this industry has its roots in male entertainment, and that anything to do with violence or sports is restricted to the male realm. For the guys, it was more of a social issue; i.e., the belief that we only stayed home and played video games because we weren't invited to the latest party, we didn't have a lot of friends, and girls really weren't in the picture.
But for the ladies, it appears to be a very different hurdle, and it goes well beyond a lack of respect when playing online. No, this might be a gender-bending issue of some sort, in that girls who enjoy games must be too…well, tomboy-ish. These days, it's like the chick who was heavy into sports and played basketball with the boys at recess. Most of those over the age of 40 who are entirely clueless about this industry will see a screen, see a gun, automatically assume the entire purpose of the game is to kill people (even if they saw the handgun in Heavy Rain ). And if they see a girl playing it, well, there has to be something wrong, right?
It just isn't lady-like. "She won't meet any nice boys that way," said grandma. And what if all this talk about games making people more violent really kicks in? Yep, the normal girl is changed into an aggressive, creepy girl. I don't know any girls who play games but if I did, I'm willing to bet they've encountered plenty of people who, upon learning they play, immediately assume they're lacking in estrogen. And worse, that they might have an over-abundance of testosterone. As gaming continues to hit a wider demographic with every passing year, I'm afraid that one set of stereotypes (all games are for boys, all games are violent, etc.), will generate another stereotype that specifically offends females.
It's bad enough that girls have to remain silent while playing online; it's even worse when they become pigeon-holed…into a pigeon-hole.
once again Ben, hats off
Yeah. But this only applies to gals complaining about male-oriented games not targeting women. Which is a silly argument to put forward.
Historically, the industry has catered to male gamers. And only relatively recently, has it started to branch out. This as a direct result of women becoming 39% of the gaming population.
That same 39% are the ones that have helped FarmVille, Animal Crossing, Little Big Planet, The Sims, Final Fantasy (plus lots of JRPG's), Point and Click Adventure games, dance & fitness simulators, etc. become such huge hits.
They're an important demographic. And game makers have already started years ago to target them more and more.
Obviously those games don't usually include the sort of stuff that makes every man grin with glee (sex, violence and mindless action).
And so far, only very few women complain about it. So it's hardly something to even worry about, really.
It's not about girls complaining at all. Has nothing to do with what you're saying.
Crap. My bad.
I clicked the highlighted text and went to the other news article and then went to Kotaku and reacted to what I had read there.
Anyway… are gals being stereotyped? Sure.
But get this. They're being stereotyped by the same people that stereotype ANYONE that plays games. The ones that think videogames turn people into killers or are a waste of time.
So why bother?
I follow (not in a creepy way) gamer girls like PinkRanger, Jo Garcia (playboys gamer next door)and a few others on YouTube mainly because I like their commentaries but I also get a feel of their perspective of gaming for females.
Jo is more a reviewer of games, while Pink posts up her gaming online with some commentaries. I'll have to root out one of Pinks videos. She's playing CoD:BO and talking about what she feels as a girl gamer the industry represents. I enjoy both girls videos and a few others I watch. They're just about having fun with their games and isn't that what it's all about. They're not much different then the guys but in no way does it even feel like they're 'Tomboys' imo.
Here's one of Pinks videos were she talks a little about how she finds gaming as a girl. I personally don't see why gender should influence how a person is perceived in gaming. Isn't having fun universal?
Frostface,
I'm like you.
But I follow my gal's on Twitter, such as….Jo Garcia, Frag Dolls, pwningbeauty, Lisa Foiles, Fillytase, and a few others
I know a girl gamer she tells me she stays quite for fear that no guy would wanna play with her cause of her skill lol or lack of, I tell her if she says shes a girl she'll probably get thousands of friends request. on a side note she plays re 5 on the 360 which just crapped out on her
Tell her to move over to a PS3, the online community is more mature.
Well that doesn't make a lick of sense… Why would anyone correlate gender to gaming skill? People are strange.
Lol she asked me for my advice in regards to her broken 360, my response get a ps3
My experience in that regard: She buys a brand new 360, discs refuse to play, she asks for advice. I, and three others tell her to trade it in and get a PS3… She replaces it with a new 360. /facepalm
Well, I'd hate to perpetuate such a myth but I have to say that in my somewhat limited experience with girl gamers, they DO tend to be the kind that have more guy friends than girl friends, aren't afraid to drink some beer now and then, and have a less than delicate sensibility.
That doesn't make it universal, but that's what I see. Of course, this all depends largely on your concept of "gamer". Girls playing dance games probably won't suffer the same stigma as a girl playing COD.
Well the "more guy friends" is something I've encountered too.
But that's not a bad, just like it's not a bad thing for us guys to have more female friends than guy friends…
Other than that the ones I know (some through PSN/ some in real life) are actually really nice not gross or like those body building/beer drinking females. They're actually just really nice.
Last edited by Scarecrow on 1/28/2011 10:58:52 PM
dont stereotype girls… stereotype girls playing CoD
For sure, one of my exes was like that. She was a gamer and a svelt little blond to boot, but she always fit the "one of the guys" mold. Not that that's bad, but it seems to fit lots of female gamers, again just in my experience.
Last edited by WorldEndsWithMe on 1/29/2011 10:56:45 AM
iJustine (L)
Interesting theory. You certainly seem to be onto something with the generalised history of the gaming industry being aimed firmly at the male market, and girls being largely looked over. This has allowed a certain kind of game to become the focus of all markets and that is ultra-violence. So, your conclusions of girls being looked down in for partaking in this particular hobby is sound.
I know few 'girl gamers', but most of them are really no different from any other girls that I know. As a matter of fact, they're generally far more approachable. Hmm… Perhaps we are heading into a world where gaming will be 'the great equaliser'. If this is so, then we are still a ways off, but it could happen.
Peace.
"A little of the old ultra-violence."
Name the movie 🙂
A Clockwork Orange. Bought the book, loved the book, bought the movie, loved the movie.
That movie is a trip.
Who would thumb down A Clockwork Orange?
People who were annoyed that the real ending was cut from the movie? I preferred the extra chapter in the book, it seemed like closure. But no, I didn't thumb it down.
Last edited by Lawless SXE on 1/29/2011 4:38:56 PM
It likely depends on the kind of game too. I played a few MMOs in the past and met quite a few female gamers. Just like everyone else, once they find a nice guild with like-minded people everything's normal.
Now online shooters… might be a different situation. I wouldn't know. I don't play them.
But MMOs are more of a communal experience anyway aren't they? It's all about working together and forming bonds, so it makes sense that the gender of a player wouldn't be an issue. I think it is more the competitive style of gaming wherein the issues lie. The whole E-Penis issue means that most guys have problems with being beaten by and, in some cases, even playing with girls. Who knows?
Takes one to know one!
*swish* –Homer Simpson
I don't know much about this stuff but I did fight a girl gamer on Tekken 6 the other night. She had a good Julie Chan
End of story.
I'll say this, you will find that the PSN community is nicer and more 'normal' towards female gamers than any other platform (Pc, 360, etc.)
Even in shooters like Uncharted3, it's not uncommon to party up with some female gamers. The guys just talk to them normally for the most part. But like always there will be jerks eventually. Other than that it's actually not so bad from what I've seen on PSN.
As far as the "tomboy-ish" stereotype. I'll be honest… I kinda like tomboy-ish girls a lot lol. But they still gotta have a cute side, not into the ones with bald heads and those extremes lol. Bah what am I saying lol…
Anyway, from what I have seen and experienced with female gamers on PSN it's not so bad. I have a feeling that a lot of the problem is coming from the 350 side of things.
from what i read, girl gamer usually just stay quiet while playing. why not mute idiots and talk with decent players? pretty much all games have that, use it all the time in black ops. thats why i like squad chat feature in killzone 2 and bad company 2. why limit your own experience when you can just block morons out. given my experience on live and a little on psn, i usually just end up playing with friends.
I don't know why everyone is acting like the PSN is all pancakes and butterflies. It isn't. Last night in Killzone 2, I had killed 3 guys in a row. On their mics they called me some vicious racial slurs, and one of them was a chick.
No is saying that PSN has absolutely NO problems; theres going to be a-holes on it too. The thing is there are far less a-holes on PSN compared to XBL.
Indeed Sonic.
I once ran into a bunch of guys playing SOCOM whose every other word was the n-word, but that is the exception rather than the rule in my experience.
Of course, part of that is the fact that no one uses a mic on PSN.
p.s. I quit that game ASAP.
Last edited by Fane1024 on 1/29/2011 3:39:15 PM
That's odd, i never had any problems with anyone on Socom what so ever. I would hear acouple swear words here and there not overly used and constant like in some games where people swear every second of breath.
But i probably only heard 1 or 3 racial slurs but that never detracted me from playing online nothing will if i want to play a game i would rather play than let some moron ruin my party. The mute button is the best invention who ever invented it is a genius.
Last edited by Clamedeus on 1/29/2011 7:23:47 PM
You think girl gamers are being considered less female because of this hobby? I doubt it. A girl shows up online and the whole room goes gaga. Unfortunately, it's the males' serious lack of getting some that brings out the worst in them. I mean seriously. Just look at the avatars we have going here.
Don't hate, appreciate.
What does one's avatar have to do with anything? Am I to assume that you have that Bleach guy avatar because you're trying to imitate someone more manly than yourself?
See how ridiculous it is?
One's avatar can stand as a joke (look at 0_o's car avatar), to a favorite character in a game/movie, to something ironic, etc. Everyone has a different statement to make.
You've been schooled, no need to pay me.
I didn't say they were seen as more manly by gamers; gamers know what video games ARE.
I'm talking about everyone ELSE. The millions outside your/our little bubble.
Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 1/29/2011 12:10:53 AM
@ Ben – Who are these people outside our bubble that you speak of?
@ Scarecrow – Were you drinking last night?
Just about everyone over the age of 50 (with the exception of BikerSaint). 😉
That, and any human alive whose only video game information comes from the mainstream media and FOX News.
ok I lurk here a lot because I use this site for sony news, but I can no longer stay quiet. I keep seeing these articles over and over about girl gamers and respect and it's starting to drive me crazy! I am a girl gamer and I have been since I was 5 years old. I certainly am NOT creepy or weird. I am 25 years old and have a full time job and have a normal life. The gaming world is male dominated but so what? I think a lot of the girls complaining just need to deal with it and shut up. It seems more like a cry for attention than just getting respect. I don't go around claiming to be a gamer because I know how people react and that's just the way it goes. I don't get upset over it, I just play games because it's what I do and it really shouldn't matter to anyone else. Can't we all just get along?
…um, sure. The article offers a question that I purposely don't answer. There are no statements being made.
Come from the shadows into the light, no need to lurk here.
Smoothhands,
"Welcome"
The more female gamers, the better.
(and as a biker, the same goes for female Harley riders, which I have helped teach 7 of them to ride)
sorry I wasn't really talking about you or anyone else here making any sort of statement towards girls. I just don't think a girl demanding respect is doing anything for girl gamers… I guess other than making it look like we are big whiners 🙁
Well, that's sort of like saying any stereotyped or oppressed group should always stay quiet because no good can come from saying anything.
…in human history, that usually doesn't work. 😉
I agree completely! But it seems the more I run across the outcries for equality, the more it seems like it's just a cry for attention. In my opinion anyway -_-
I guess there's a time and a place for everything. If there were a 100 MLK's during the time when the slavery was in it's prime and the national economy was dependent on it, or 100 Ghandi's when the British Raj were in their ascension, without the coverage of global mass media, or a Jesus came before the rise and fall of the Roman empire, we would've never heard of the plight of these trailblazing revolutionaries.
Having said that, girl gamers getting the respect they deserve from the gaming community at large is the day everyone of them grows up, or mass censorship is enforced. Since neither of them are likely to take place, girl gamers should do what every other self-respecting person should do: stick to playing games with your friends and people who you know.
While I agree that some people won't ever "grow up" you can't expect to play something like the multiplayer for uncharted 2 and somehow end up with a team made solely of people you know. That's also pretty unrealistic.
You can't invite friends in mp match in U2? Maybe, a lot of games lack decent party/lobby system. In such cases where you have no choice, practice reserve…the regular trash doesn't have to know you are a girl gamer, black gamers, white gamer, old gamer, young gamer, straight gamer, gay gamer, or whoever one is. And if a person is trying to gain acceptance from the gamer crowd, they may have some preexisting self-esteem problems of their own.
no you CAN invite friends in MP, however, when there were 5 of my friends playing it would always be against another team of 5 strangers. I don't play a whole lot of MP games, but I would imagine it would be hard to only play with friends for a lot of them.
I could see if one doesn't play much mp, one doesn't get a chance to make too many online friends, and at the same time, one doesn't have to deal with rubbish too much of the time, either.
But I repeat, not everybody has to know who you are, what you are, where you live, etc…Morever, you kinda have to go out of your way to reveal that.
Shams,
Just like me, nobody here knows I'm a 58 year old gamer.
"Er….Oh wait"………