Ben-DutkaHere's the thing: when developers first attempted to institute realistic emotions into video games, it was amateur-hour for quite some time. We all remember the cheesy and downright painful and although the industry has taken great strides since, I'm wondering if everything is still too one-dimensional…
As advanced as games have become, the writers still haven't managed to really push past the predictable and even cliched. Perhaps the Metal Gear Solid franchise and a few RPGs here and there are the exceptions to the rule, but considering all the technology and voice talent designers have at their disposal, I'd like to think we could explore more of the human condition through video games. At this point, it seems inevitable that games will continue to inch closer to movies in terms of realistic special effects and CGI and all that, but artistic drama will be left far behind. For my part, I expect feeling to be a part of my entertainment experiences; I've long since grown bored with new and flashier ways to blow something up. Unfortunately, this adolescent emphasis seems to have rubbed off on the video game industry.
Don't get me wrong; I'm all for technological advances, but when we have to sacrifice the emotional IQ of the characters we see on screen, the production loses a great deal of appeal in my eyes. When I go to the movie theater (which is rare these days), I want to see some substance, but I'm starting to wonder if I'll have to spend more time at stage theaters. The good news is that I've seen fantastic potential in games and I freely admit to having cried at certain video games in the past. When Aeris died…? The end of MGS3…? C'mon, if you didn't have a few tears in your eyes, you were either braindead or a robot. But how come I haven't had more experiences like this? Given the rapid rate of advancement in the industry, one would assume I would've had many, many more. Perhaps we just need better scripts. Perhaps developers need to realize that the performances are quickly becoming crucially important; almost as important as the gameplay, graphics, sound and other technical categories.
I just hope there are enough gamers out there who will reward someone who eventually produces an intensely emotional game script. Because one day, someone is gonna try and if they're not rewarded, we'll just be stuck with more over-the-top action titles and FPSs. Not that that's a bad thing, per se…I'm just saying.
I have every Silent Hill to date (except the crap that Homecoming was)
And yes, SH2 is very emotional, but at the same level of say FFX or FFVIII? Not really
It was a great experience with a GREAT storyline, but in terms of emotions it doesn't top the best rpgs.
i'd be repeating myself if i were to fully reply to you guys.
Art is subjecttive and so is emotion.
Silent Hill 2 is highest on both of them. If the Hill spoke to you, it will have you in the midst of its beautiful poetic masterpiece of a world. If it does not, generic storytelling is for you.
Silent Hill 2 spoke to me and im an art-house lover, it is the most emotional ive ever witnessed and my gaming library consists of the FF's, xenogears, chrono, legend of dragoon, vagrant story gta, mgs, the broken swords, all the way to Shenmue. Nothing on Silent Hill 2.
of course there are games with a more 3d approach to storytelling and they tackle themes, world issues and are more profound ala mgs and most jrpgs but, its not on a lynchian Silent Hill level. This is something that is targeted at a very specific audience who will understand it. its unique and innovative.
Many people play Silent Hill as a survival horror looking to get scared….thats why they miss the point.
My previous posts say it all.
When i find a game with more depth, art, emotion, atmosphere and attention to detail, i will let you know.
Last edited by Lotusflow3r on 8/15/2009 4:38:15 PM
Well I have every SH, so I do not play it to get scared or for survival horror purposes.
I do see its depth and understand/try to understand its plots as much as possible.
I guess it's all personal preference then. It's like the difference between genres, comparing metal to ballads will get you in trouble.
Yeah, i agree its down to preference totally.
I just have trouble with a person who doesn't prefer that type AND criticises it. So, i was just pointing out the fact that it is what it is and should be recognised for that whether its their preference or not.
I'll tell you something what is undeniably emotional though! Seeing Team Silent (Silent Hill creators) have their creation ripped from them and passed to a western developer and having it commercialised and butchered….just because they didn't want to continue the series nor commercialise it…
Now that is a heartbreaker.
DAMN THOSE MEN IN SUITS!!
Last edited by Lotusflow3r on 8/15/2009 5:36:32 PM
Lotusflow, it'd be a terrible idea to think I didn't "understand" SH2. I don't brag about a damn thing but my literary comprehension has always been superior. I enjoy taking time to discuss novels like "The Magic Mountain" with Thomas Mann scholars. I've written reviews on everything from books to movies to games.
To assume I didn't understand something as unbelievably adolescent as SH2 isn't a good idea. As much as I love storytelling in games, there has never once been anything in this industry that is beyond my comprehension. It's still far too in the way of amateur.
Literary skill is evident in the masters. You can believe what you want, but there isn't anything remotely masterful about SH2.
Lol this reminds me of the scene in Woody Allen's Annie Hall. Where Alvys in the theatre line irriated by the teacher in line pontificating on movies Alvy loves, The teacher then backs up by saying his knowlegde on a certain guy, Alvy then pulls out the guy from no where and he owns the teacher.
Ben, i'd be repeating myself again.
You can be a critic or what not but this doesn't change a thing, many critics fail to understand certain things, Twin Peaks (ironicly, the movie Silent Hill 2 mostly gets compared to) was hacked when it came out but, today, now that the public fell in love with it and the fact it needed to have a long digest, it's considered an all time movie masterpiece by those critics…critics are not inhuman, they miss points too. Having said that, and as ive previously stated, many critics have shared my view on Silent Hill 2 and many outside of the gaming industry have shown their love and admiration for it…Isn't that what we are also talking about here? Emotional impact, the importance of it and how the "game" is viewed outside of just gamers. Well, Silent Hill 2 was 2001 (the 1st 1998!) and they did what games like Heavy Rain are just beginning to do (bar the original Silent Hill's lousy voice acting).
Ben, i don't have much of a problem with your views (hence why im here!) but, what you said about Silent Hill 2 is laughable. It was groundbreaking and innovative in the storytelling aspect for games.
You could write essays on what Silent Hill 2 means to not only yourself, but, its statements on humanity and the darkness we seem to not resist, each characters reason for existence, why you see what you see, why certain sounds are used, certain camera angles are used, music, clothing, why the "creatures" are what they are and whether they're really there…You would literally be there for weeks writing away and STILL would not touch the bottom of it….could i do that for Final Fantasy VII? no. Not that that is a bad thing, Fantasy VII is just a great straight forward plot and therefore wouldn't require so much analysis. But, it's a number one at what it does and one of my ultimate games. I'm stating a point, Silent Hill 2 is deep and articulate, like an artistic novel, like an artistic movie and like the painting you just can't stop looking at.
Watch the making of Silent Hill 2 for more insight. It also gets hailed a complete work of art in the same documentary.
To take Silent Hill 2's importance for granted is not a good look…
Anyway, i appreciate your views and enjoyed this conversation, Ben and the others.
@Ultima, lmao! Great movie.
Last edited by Lotusflow3r on 8/16/2009 5:01:32 AM
I just don't think you're getting it. I GET all that. It's not HARD to get all that. In fact, it's painfully evident. Do you understand what I normally read…? I'm sorry, but as I said before, I KNOW SH2 had a great story…for VIDEO GAMES. You can't call it masterful by any stretch of the imagination. And as there was basically no real dialogue writing, that's a major lacking, no matter how you slice it. But you're certainly welcome to like it, and think it's more than it is…we all have to be entertained, and we all have to enjoy that entertainment. I'm glad SH2 meant so much to you.
Ultima: Annie Hall is my mother's favorite movie. I like it, too, but not to the same extent. I do remember that scene, though. 🙂
Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 8/16/2009 9:23:48 PM
I got teary eyed in Heavenly Sword and anyone who has played it knows which scenes and characters got me choked up. Didn't want to be specific so as to avoid any spoilers. Valkyria Chronicles got to me also.
Yeah, that's true. Heavenly Sword was great…severely underrated, IMO.
She still have the voice of a bloke though
Such a beautiful game!
Any person who actually plays this game all the way through INSTANTLY becomes a huge fan of this game.
There's no way you can't enjoy the storyline in that game. The characters are so out there, and every one of them with their own little charm.
For me it's all 'bout that cutie, Kai! She's so awesome <3
emotions is probobly what made the metal gear series so popular. So yes the gaming industry could use a little more emotions in it's games
Do games need to be more emotional? In a word NO, but what games need to be is MORE FUN because these days FUN seem to be taking a backseat to the ridiculous things developers have been force-feeding.
WHAT? Aeris dies?!
Just kidding. I know she does.
I think it's kind of hard to cry during an FPS where the entire story revolves around kicking tail. The only emotion I get during FPS stories is rage (end of CoD4, end of KZ2, etc.). I think they're doing an okay job with that portion.
RPG's give me a much better variety, but those games are more story-based and less shooting-based.
Rage at multiplayer goons "Shakes fist in anger"
Actually when I finished KZ2 I really had this awful feeling about Rico… son of…
That's what I was talking about. So, at the end, there is almost no closure AND we get pissed off at Rico.
Hence rage.
Well I don't know about all this crying because of Aeris, but certainly emotions play a huge part in making the gamer relate to the characters on screen. I was more like "I'M COMING FOR YOU SEPHIROTH!" than "Booo Hooo Hooo." Either way it's emotion and that's what drives many gamers to keep playing. To take out emotion and replace it with run-and-gun would be a huge mistake. Sadly many devs don't have good writers.
You sir have a hollow tin chest 😉
I'm more of a jaw-dropper than a cryer.
I fully support any attempt towards emotions and story lines in the gaming industry. I know a lot of people who know very little of the gaming world and just assume that every game is just a mindless blood bath. These people clearly don't even know what RPG stands for or have heard of the MGS series for that matter.
The stronger the story, emotions, acting, and etc influence there is the more respect we can get from a broader general of people.
just like anything in any media, theres a time and a place. i think if the games story based, emotion has a place. if its gameplay driven, i.e. COD or something similar, i'm pretty sure i'd want the focus elsewhere.
plus, i dont want my game turning into a old-lady-romance-novel with a lead character named Juan. there will come a line with the emotion, and i guarantee somebody will cross it.
ITA There's really nothing outside of jrpgs. I think Heavy Rain will fill the void,maybe others will follow. I wish the writer of of Kaim's dreams would write a story for new game.
"I wish the writer of of Kaim's dreams would write a story for new game." — that will be an instant classic right there, and the deepest
I mentioned to some game illiterates how the soldiers behind Six Days in Fallujah wanted to tell their story, and one of them it like "Tell their story through a video game?" I was disappointed, people still think there are no storylines or memorable characters in games.
Heavy Rain is suppost to evoke all different kinds of emotions, thats why I want the game!
wow…. no mention of FFX??
i thought that was even more emotional than FFVII
It was imo
Personally I find FFVII to be a bit overrated
Heck, FFVIII was more emotional in my opinion
Well, if anything they all have that in common, they all use emotion and deep story lines.
i agree
one thing that actually made FFX more emotional was of course the voices. it really made the characters seem more believable.
if u saw my previous posts a while ago, you know i am with you that FF7 is probably the most over-hyped game of all time by today's Square business practices. It was fine back then when it was released on its own, with that said, i am not saying this is not a great game, just over-hyped.
I got emotional when I play FFX as well, but I really don't think FFVII is in any way shape or form overrated. I guess because I am a sucker for love stories and you definitely get love stories in FF VII, VIII, and X. Anybody enjoyed X-2? I think it was alright.
Last edited by Kai200X on 8/16/2009 3:00:31 AM
Don't bother responding to Drithe. He's gone again.
We don't accept idiots.
You accepted me back. Thanks btw, o and my two cents on this whole emotion thing, I still love My MGS2: Sons Of Liberty, gotta love that scene with Raiden and Snake after the whole sword battle, but, if your looking for emotion, look no further then MGS, and yes, MGS 3 is amazing to, the whole monkeys from Ape Quest level, that was epic. but im getting off-topic and im rambling, so ill stop now.
Max Payne was my first emotional gaming experience, it rocked
This article is one of the reasons why I continue to come here daily. I have only cared about a few of the video game characters I "used", with the most recent being my character from Fallout 3.
I am a huge supporter of the bringing more drama into video games, and agree that games have begun a shift to more and more brutal violence.
I my book, inFamous was a perfect setting for an emotional rollercoaster.
– The city being forced into chaos.
– The moral choices.
– The love interest.
– The relationship with his friend.
Plenty of subject matter to explore in a deeper context.
MGS3 was damn emotional…..
The Boss' sacrifice was too damn sad though I didn't cry but I do however felt it.
The one that really made it emotional was probably when Big Boss was listening to EVA's recording like:
"Yet no one will know what she had done"
or
"People will brand her as traitor and future generations will….."
Ok, I admit I forgot what EVA said but I do remember it was sad hearing those words so if you know what was wrong with my quoting of EVA then correct me.
that ending was probably the single most emotional or saddest moment in the entire gaming history to date, not to exaggerate