Ben-DutkaThat Horizon: Zero Dawn unveiling at E3 was pretty freakin' awesome.
And it begs the question: If developers take a risk and leave tried-and-true franchises behind, can they produce even better IPs? On the flip side, will the millions of fans they accumulated from the first successful IP feel slighted?
I know several people who were hoping Guerrilla Games would reveal a new Killzone entry. I think many will agree that the PS4 launch title, Shadow Fall , was a good game but a little underwhelming (even if expectations for the new generation were absolutely through the roof). And there are many who remember previous entries with a great fondness, so they wanted to see what Guerrilla had in store for the franchise.
Now, while the developer says they haven't abandoned Killzone , it's clear that their focus is currently on the new Horizon IP. I think it looks fantastic and it's a huge departure from Killzone . It's precisely what I wish more developers would do; break out of their comfort zone and deliver something ambitious and fresh. I have no way of knowing if Horizon will be a great game but I think everyone is anticipating something special.
The question is, if the game does very well, should Guerrilla even bother returning to Killzone ? I mean, they probably should, but what if Horizon becomes a huge new franchise? Wouldn't they want to stick with the money-maker? And one could argue that Killzone hasn't been so amazing, and it's better to stick with the fantastic new IP. I'm just wondering what FPS fans think…
Related Game(s): Horizon: Zero Dawn
Why not have two big name games? That only benefits gamers.
I'm not sure how big GG is, but I doubt they have the personnel to dedicate to two full time franchises, assuming Horizon becomes that.
That's silly. Any company could do that considering time management is done correctly. We are assuming these are going to be 2 successful games so cash flow isn't or shouldn't be an issue. If delegation. Is handled well there's not an issue.
In other words the games dont have to release simultaneously let alone 1 year apart. They could easily work on one, start another. That's apparently what happened anyways. ND isn't nearly as big as rockstar or Bethesda – who release their 2 biggest franchises years apart – and they pulled it off very well with Uncharted 3 and TLOU. It's all about delegation.
GG has two studios that are decent in size, and they have Sony. They will be fine in whatever they decide to do I think.
Last edited by bigrailer19 on 6/23/2015 11:32:00 PM
I agree with Biggy here – also there's nothing wrong in letting it go 6-7 years between each new iteration in a franchise. Quite the contrary, imo.
But I'd rather have them make yet another new IP. 🙂
6-7 years, sure. I guess I was operating from the assumption that we're talking about tackling both at the same time, or in close succession. Developers like Ubisoft can do Far Cry and Assassin's Creed that way because they can throw thousands of people at projects.
GG was taking two years between KZ installments, which is pretty standard. If they alternated between titles and released one game in each franchise every four years, I could see that working from a logistics standpoint, but even then it's a tight fit IMO.
I will care if they make killzone great again, killzone 2 is the best killzone i ever played, killzone 3 and SF is just decent IMO…
Totally agree. KZ2 made me enjoy first person shooters with its freshness and superb gameplay (opinion), but KZ3 introduced alot of things I did not like like the faster gameplay, terrible cliche story with an awful ending, and the revamped multiplayer that did not mirror KZ2 at all. KZ2 was my go to online shooter at the time and when I bought KZ3, I thought it would take that mantle. I was sorely wrong always saying to myself while playing "Why did they do that?".
KZ turned into another military shooter, but in space and that is where my fascination with the series ended. I didn't even bother with Shadow Fall.
Killzone 2 was great. Killzone 3 was way too on rails for me. I think it had to do with it being built around Move compatibility though I might be mistaken. But it wasn't as good as it could be. KZ Shadow Fall was a good game, one of the prettiest to date on the PS4 but it was just lacking something and I felt it was a slog getting to the end. The MP on KZ:SF was quite fun if I my memory serves.
Yes I agree FM23, kz3 was terribly cliche indeed. I cringed over the too blatantly obvious caricatures of world leaders.
I had more fun playing Killzone 3 than playing Killzone Shadow Fail…
I liked KZ3 better than 2, but hey we're all different. Also I think the second half of Shadow Fall was a fantastic game, it's just the first few missions that were kinda boring.
I say just stick with Horizon and make it awesome. Killzone (for me) is dead. I could careless about a sequel, prequel, all of it. GG's highlight in the series was KZ2 and after that they just went down hill with the series. Kind of like Assassin Creed after Brotherhood in my opinion. But AC went down a slower decline compared to KZ in my opinion.
Well I never cared about Killzone so that won't change anything. 🙂
No but seriously, this new IP looks miles more original and exciting than Killzone, who really was just a pot-pourri of most war and action clichés shoehorned into one storyline.
It's far too early to say for sure of course, but I agree with Bens view, this does indeed look like a prime example of how developers *should* break out of established IPs and start with new stuff, floating on the experience from building the former IPs.
Last edited by Beamboom on 6/24/2015 4:30:41 AM
They need to make any FPS in the spirit of Killzone 2 for the PS4. That whole project was fantastic, especially the way the multiplayer worked from the strong assets.
It will be massive now because of much closer gap in online connectivity for PS4 vs X0. All we were missing were the players. It had such great balance, great rewarding learning curve with major feelings of satisfaction but the new players would get such a hard time from the amazing teams so they would just leave.
Now we have a a great foundation of people who can sway the trend and help others stay.
Sony has the last say. Probably Because killzone isn't so hot, they let guerilla take some time off and work on this. If this was halo and Microsoft, it'd be a no no. So really has lot of it has to do with performance. If this makes it big, then it'll stay and the next killzone won't be till guerilla games can split like naughty dog. Naughty dog was able to make last of us because they got big and split. Pretty simple imo.
Ben, you'll be glad to know I DO like the looks of this game 🙂
Last edited by frostface on 6/24/2015 5:49:44 AM
I'm sure he's dancing in joy just about now. 🙂
I figure he needs some cheering up lol
Doubt it…since this is a positive post his eyes will just skim over it and his brain won't process it. He'll just wait until you say something negative and remind you that his brother hates your face…then proceed to call anyone who tells him to calm down an "asshat" and that he has the right to be a jerk.
I don't think this will cheer him. 🙂
Best to let go while the going is good.
No. Please. Let Guerrilla Games move on already!! We've had five, FIVE Killzone titles developed by Guerrilla Games (and one developed by Guerrilla Camrbridge on the Vita). Let the series take a break. Naughty Dog even confirmed Uncharted 4 will be the last Uncharted title before they move onto a new IP.
Horizon swept E3's awards. That never happened with Killzone as far as I know. Plus, all over the internet people are praising this game. It looks incredible, a giant open-world RPG with a very interesting story and lots of promise. Let's just let Guerrilla Games focus on this new IP/franchise and leave Killzone to rest.
I'm actually surprised that Guerrilla Cambridge is working on a Project Morpheus title. I thought they would take over the series since they worked on the Vita title but I guess not. Works for me though. Killzone was always fun but time to move on truthfully. That's why I respect and support Sony so much.
Last edited by DrRockso87 on 6/24/2015 6:59:15 AM
I thought HOrizen was gonna be multiplayer. After I seen it wasnt I am no longer interested.
You always find something to hate don't you :p
I'm guessing you intentionally wrote "HO"rizen in response to the female lead?
I hope he didn't.
These are the type of articles I like from Ben! Great question and framed in a way for a good discussion. This what and why I became a fan of this site.
Ben, I don't feel slighted by by his move. KZ is a good franchise but seems wanting of late..
I'm super excited by this IP. I think Guerrilla will benefit greatly from this move. The learnings from doing something new and the switch to 3rd person perspective can only benefit them. I think this is a smart move and personally I prefer 3rd person. Don't get me wrong I like FSP and will never shy away from a game because its first person. Over the years I have developed a preference for 3rd person.
I don't think Guerrilla should abandon KZ. I hope that focusing on something new and fresh that pushed then creatively will make KZ's next chapter as exciting as Zero Dawn!
I just think Killzone is such an unnecessary series. It was a blatant attempt by Sony to get an answer to Halo, and while it certainly has good qualities, it's ultimately a mashup of tropes that doesn't really bring anything essential to the sci-fi FPS genre. Also, while Halo is still big, it's not nearly the juggernaut it used to be. Tastes have changed considerably since it's heyday, so the need to have an "answer" to it really doesn't exist anymore (if it ever did.)
Considering the futuristic yet still primal look of Horizon…what if they combined Killzone AND Horizon and named it something like…"Killzone on the Horizon" ok that name is bad but hear me out. I'm not the most informed of Killzone even though I did play all of them. What if the heroine got kidnapped by the Helghast or if something happened and they landed on her planet? A struggle between her primal primitive yet futuristic weapons vs their plasma rifles and such? It could be a pretty sweet collaboration I think. They might have to choose 3rd person to do it right though with how I envision the main game being 3rd person they should take after Horizon and not Killzone. Also I prefer 3rd person shooters anyway. I like to see my character, I don't need to see through their eyes to interact with the world….
Killrizon? Horizone? 😛
Last edited by Legendary Minja on 6/24/2015 4:28:36 PM
I'd be positively ecstatic if every long-running FPS franchise was ditched and the developers went to work on new IP's instead.
Considering the futuristic yet still primal look of Horizon…what if they combined Killzone AND Horizon and named it something like…"Killzone on the Horizon" ok that name is bad but hear me out. I'm not the most informed of Killzone even though I did play all of them. What if the heroine got kidnapped by the Helghast or if something happened and they landed on her planet? A struggle between her primal primitive yet futuristic weapons vs their plasma rifles and such? It could be a pretty sweet collaboration I think. They might have to choose 3rd person to do it right though with how I envision the main game being 3rd person they should take after Horizon and not Killzone. Also I prefer 3rd person shooters anyway. I like to see my character, I don't need to see through their eyes to interact with the world….
Killrizon? Horizone? 😛
Last edited by Legendary Minja on 6/24/2015 4:28:36 PM
I'm not sure how big GG is, but I doubt they have the personnel to dedicate to two full time franchises, assuming Horizon becomes that.
Why not have two big name games? That only benefits gamers.
That's silly. Any company could do that considering time management is done correctly. We are assuming these are going to be 2 successful games so cash flow isn't or shouldn't be an issue. If delegation. Is handled well there's not an issue.
In other words the games dont have to release simultaneously let alone 1 year apart. They could easily work on one, start another. That's apparently what happened anyways. ND isn't nearly as big as rockstar or Bethesda – who release their 2 biggest franchises years apart – and they pulled it off very well with Uncharted 3 and TLOU. It's all about delegation.
GG has two studios that are decent in size, and they have Sony. They will be fine in whatever they decide to do I think.
Last edited by bigrailer19 on 6/23/2015 11:32:00 PM
I will care if they make killzone great again, killzone 2 is the best killzone i ever played, killzone 3 and SF is just decent IMO…
Totally agree. KZ2 made me enjoy first person shooters with its freshness and superb gameplay (opinion), but KZ3 introduced alot of things I did not like like the faster gameplay, terrible cliche story with an awful ending, and the revamped multiplayer that did not mirror KZ2 at all. KZ2 was my go to online shooter at the time and when I bought KZ3, I thought it would take that mantle. I was sorely wrong always saying to myself while playing "Why did they do that?".
KZ turned into another military shooter, but in space and that is where my fascination with the series ended. I didn't even bother with Shadow Fall.
Yes I agree FM23, kz3 was terribly cliche indeed. I cringed over the too blatantly obvious caricatures of world leaders.
6-7 years, sure. I guess I was operating from the assumption that we're talking about tackling both at the same time, or in close succession. Developers like Ubisoft can do Far Cry and Assassin's Creed that way because they can throw thousands of people at projects.
GG was taking two years between KZ installments, which is pretty standard. If they alternated between titles and released one game in each franchise every four years, I could see that working from a logistics standpoint, but even then it's a tight fit IMO.
I agree with Biggy here – also there's nothing wrong in letting it go 6-7 years between each new iteration in a franchise. Quite the contrary, imo.
But I'd rather have them make yet another new IP. 🙂
Sony has the last say. Probably Because killzone isn't so hot, they let guerilla take some time off and work on this. If this was halo and Microsoft, it'd be a no no. So really has lot of it has to do with performance. If this makes it big, then it'll stay and the next killzone won't be till guerilla games can split like naughty dog. Naughty dog was able to make last of us because they got big and split. Pretty simple imo.
I liked KZ3 better than 2, but hey we're all different. Also I think the second half of Shadow Fall was a fantastic game, it's just the first few missions that were kinda boring.
They need to make any FPS in the spirit of Killzone 2 for the PS4. That whole project was fantastic, especially the way the multiplayer worked from the strong assets.
It will be massive now because of much closer gap in online connectivity for PS4 vs X0. All we were missing were the players. It had such great balance, great rewarding learning curve with major feelings of satisfaction but the new players would get such a hard time from the amazing teams so they would just leave.
Now we have a a great foundation of people who can sway the trend and help others stay.
Killzone 2 was great. Killzone 3 was way too on rails for me. I think it had to do with it being built around Move compatibility though I might be mistaken. But it wasn't as good as it could be. KZ Shadow Fall was a good game, one of the prettiest to date on the PS4 but it was just lacking something and I felt it was a slog getting to the end. The MP on KZ:SF was quite fun if I my memory serves.
I had more fun playing Killzone 3 than playing Killzone Shadow Fail…
Well I never cared about Killzone so that won't change anything. 🙂
No but seriously, this new IP looks miles more original and exciting than Killzone, who really was just a pot-pourri of most war and action clichés shoehorned into one storyline.
It's far too early to say for sure of course, but I agree with Bens view, this does indeed look like a prime example of how developers *should* break out of established IPs and start with new stuff, floating on the experience from building the former IPs.
Last edited by Beamboom on 6/24/2015 4:30:41 AM
I'm sure he's dancing in joy just about now. 🙂
Doubt it…since this is a positive post his eyes will just skim over it and his brain won't process it. He'll just wait until you say something negative and remind you that his brother hates your face…then proceed to call anyone who tells him to calm down an "asshat" and that he has the right to be a jerk.
I figure he needs some cheering up lol
Ben, you'll be glad to know I DO like the looks of this game 🙂
Last edited by frostface on 6/24/2015 5:49:44 AM
I don't think this will cheer him. 🙂
Best to let go while the going is good.
I'm guessing you intentionally wrote "HO"rizen in response to the female lead?