Gamers and journalists have been saying it for quite some time: when you produce a multiplatform title, you may have to make exceptions (to keep the game mostly identical on all targeted platforms), and on the flip side, a purely exclusive project should allow the team to excel.

Well, Sucker Punch tends to agree. In a recent IndustryGamers interview with studio co-founder Brian Fleming, he tells us why the team remains on good terms with Sony, and how designing multiplatform titles can lead to "problems and compromises." While avoiding exclusive projects certainly gives you a wider audience, Fleming believes one should "assess what you value," and Sucker Punch saw value in maintaining their long-standing relationship with Sony. But interestingly enough, it's not about loyalty, it's about making the best game you want to make…and if they were to go to another platform at some point, that game would probably be exclusive to that console. Said Fleming:

"I think you can get very caught up on 'we have to do cross-platform' and end up failing on axes that might be more important to you, like your happiness, the quality of the games you make, the patience of the publisher when a game is struggling – inFamous struggled for a while before we found our footing – and we appreciate that [Sony's patience] because it made our lives better. At the same time, we're not in this for charity; it's a for profit business and we have a business model that leads us in that direction, but you do have to be careful about being greedy. We love being first-party, so if we did something different I don't think we'd be cross-platform… I think we'd want to do some exclusive on some other platform."

It's certainly an interesting take, and one we believe more developers should have. It's no coincidence that many of the best games of this generation are platform exclusives (MGS4, Killzone 2 , Gears of War , etc.), so obviously, the idea that developers can push the envelope when not having to constantly concern themselves with multiplatform isn't so silly. inFamous is great fun, but Sucker Punch thinks they may have had to cut some corners if it weren't exclusive. And that's exactly the point.

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BIG_E
BIG_E
11 years ago

The sound of this is sweet music to me.This team is one of the best.I would love to see Slycooper4

dfoz3
dfoz3
11 years ago

Ironic that these comments will be turned into a Sucker Punch love fest by the same people who flamed Valve to hell and back yesterday. They stated the same reasoning that Valve did although with a little more tact. Please go ahead and vote me down now for not being part of the Sony hive-mind.

Oxvial
Oxvial
11 years ago

The problem Valve says .

PS3 a "waste of time"

Jawknee
Jawknee
11 years ago

to be fair. Sucker Punch stated that if they moved to another platform it would be exclusive to that platform. Valve just flat out said its too hard. Valve hasnt made a good game since Half Life and Counter Strike on the PC. Either Valve is a crappy dev, or they are lazy. Im enclined to think both. Thumbs down!

Ben Dutka PSXE
Ben Dutka PSXE
11 years ago

Yeah. There may be a SLIGHT difference between saying, "we can make the best game possible by being exclusive" and saying "the PS3 is too complicated for us so we won't do it."

Just a slight difference. 'rolling eyes'

Evil Incarnate
Evil Incarnate
11 years ago

It was the way Valve's Tom Leonard stated it. A reasonable statement like this compared to Tom Leonard's statement is like comparing apples to oranges.


Last edited by Evil Incarnate on 6/11/2009 12:41:34 PM

dfoz3
dfoz3
11 years ago

"But I think there's a small selfish component to what we do in that we want to run a business that we truly enjoy, and doing cross-platform, while you would reach more people, it also introduces a whole bunch of problems and compromises and difficulty that doesn't make making games a lot more fun."

– Quoted from the interview. As I said, Sucker Punch may have used more tact, but they said the same thing.

I just think it is funny how insecure the hardcore PS fanboys seem to be over things like this. Give Valve some credit, they would not be successful if everything they made sucked and was lazily produced.

Anonymous
Anonymous
11 years ago

I'm the same way sometimes dfoz (about the too much love part), but I have to agree with everyone else on this. It's a completely different statement.

Sony better buy Insomniac, Sucker Punch and Naught Dog dammit!

dfoz3
dfoz3
11 years ago

Sucker Punch's reasoning:

"…doing cross-platform, while you would reach more people, it also introduces a whole bunch of problems and compromises and difficulty that doesn't make making games a lot more fun. In fact, I think it subtracts from that."

Compared to Valve's reasoning:

"The PC and the 360 are just more straightforward. We can focus on what we want to do, which is make game experiences, instead of sweating bullets over obscure architectural decisions they make with their platform. […] I didn’t come into this business in the 90s because of some technical fetish. I came in because I wanted to give people experiences that made them have fun."

How is there a huge difference between these statements? They are both stating that they choose to stick with their respective platforms because it is simpler and more enjoyable. Pretty straight forward. The difference in tone can be attributed to the difference between every human being.

Valve's may seem more derogatory but really all he is saying is that he wants to have fun rather than worry about Sony's more complicated architecture. How is calling their architecture more complicated an insult? It appears factual given the length of time Sony's exclusives take to develop compared to other platforms.

Evil Incarnate
Evil Incarnate
11 years ago

@Stickemup Naughty Dog is part of World Wide Studios. So we don't have to worry about that. I do agree they should try to acquire Insomniac and Sucker Punch.


Last edited by Evil Incarnate on 6/11/2009 1:29:02 PM

Jawknee
Jawknee
11 years ago

Valve is trying to throw the blame at Sony for their short comings. Thats how i read their statement. Simple as that.

Kevadu
Kevadu
11 years ago

I completely agree with you, dfoz3. I very nearly made a similar post earlier but I decided I just didn't want to get into it. But since you brought it up…

The double standard here is astounding. Although they used different words to express it, the reasoning of the two companies is basically the same. So to be fair we should all be flaming Sucker Punch now, right? ūüėČ

Evil Incarnate
Evil Incarnate
11 years ago

@dfoz3 (but really all he is saying is that he wants to have fun rather than worry about Sony's more complicated architecture.)

Then why didn't he just say that and leave out the insults and blame. You basically answered your own question. I don't hear Sucker Punch saying we don't want to make games for MS because they have an achievements or avatar fetish. I don't know if you realize this but, their are professional statements like this one and unprofessional statements like Valve's.


Last edited by Evil Incarnate on 6/11/2009 1:52:50 PM

Evil Incarnate
Evil Incarnate
11 years ago

@dfoz3 (but really all he is saying is that he wants to have fun rather than worry about Sony's more complicated architecture.)

Then why didn't he just say that. You basically answered you own question.

dfoz3
dfoz3
11 years ago

@EVILINCARNATE-

Obviously I am just spinning my tires here but I simply paraphrased what Valve said rather than "answering my own question" as you seem to think.

I guess the difference here is that I enjoy Valve's games both on PC and the 360. Everyone else here that is bashing them for their remarks are Sony Fanboys that either haven't had the opportunity to properly enjoy their games or blindly hate them for the simple fact that they develop for the rival console.

As I have had to state before, I am no fanboy of any system. I love gaming on any and all platforms that offer quality games. Valve's games are quality games and millions of sales support that opinion.

vicious54
vicious54
11 years ago

Valve is like Michael Moore, fat and annoying that is probably why no one likes them.

What Valve said, is that they are not willing to learn anything new and you have SP who said they don't want to dull their game any. What is so similar about the two statements.

I don't want to insult your intelligence but come on you are reaching.


Last edited by vicious54 on 6/11/2009 2:04:33 PM

Oyashiro
Oyashiro
11 years ago

Its not quite the same.

SP Is basically saying that regardless of platform, developing exclusively allows you concentrate on a project without worrying how it will work out on a different console. Thus letting you polish a game to the strengths of the system without compensating for another.

Valve is saying flat out that PS3 is too complicated and not worth their time. It might just be the poorly worded, but Leonard made it out to be Sony's fault and not Valves for being a poor developer.

SP: Exclusives, regardless of platform are great.
Valve: PS3 is too hard to program for so we are going to ignore it.

There is a difference. I fully believe if they wanted to SP could make a great 360 game, Valve with PS3…not so much.

Evil Incarnate
Evil Incarnate
11 years ago

@dfoz3 I do not mind Valve at all! I use steam often and believe they do offer valuable services and software. But I will not defend poorly worded statements from any person in a professional field during an interview. Including Sony! If you say something stupid you should catch flak for it.


Last edited by Evil Incarnate on 6/11/2009 2:14:52 PM

Fabi
Fabi
11 years ago

It's a different statement dude.

Valve said because the PS3 is difficult to code for, they are too lazy to do it.

Sucker Punch said it doesn't matter which platform it's on, they will learn it, but they will only concentrate on making a game for that system to get the most out of it.

RadioHeader
RadioHeader
11 years ago

You guys almost got into a PS3 versus PS3 war. Are the xbots extinct?

King James
King James
11 years ago

Ladies & Gentleman:
This plane has now been HI-JACKED. PLZ remained seated with your seatbelt fastened.


Last edited by King James on 6/11/2009 5:43:36 PM

somethingrandom
somethingrandom
11 years ago

If Valve was making PS3 exclusives only, you would support them. You know, maybe Valve is just a little frustrated that investing in the PS3 market would cost so much because of Sony's vastly different architecture. You have to look at it from their point of view. I swear, if you guys don't quit this biased bull-crap I'll become a new JoshuaAdam360, and I hated that guy.

mexgeo86
mexgeo86
11 years ago

Quality vs Quantity

Jawknee
Jawknee
11 years ago

Exactly my point. There are few developers left that have this mind set. Slowely all the great developers have been going to way of Quantity and their games have suffered as a resault. Best example this generation is Resident Evil 5. What a piece that game turned out to be. you can finish it in 3 hours if you rush. pathetic.

SPS3
SPS3
11 years ago

Sweet sweet music to my ears SP. Id rather have inFamous than L4D2 and day! Now how about some next-gen Sly Cooper sequels!

RustEDalex
RustEDalex
11 years ago

yeah and it sucks bowls when the PS3 get the inferior of the multiplatform game, but hopefully thing will change as soon as FF XIII comes out

Jawknee
Jawknee
11 years ago

well see. Im starting to worry about FFXIII. it looks great but its not looking as good as i would expect it to look for a game thats supposed to be using "100% of the PS3's power". MGS4 and KZ2 look better. FF Versus XIII looks like it might be better as well.

Ben Dutka PSXE
Ben Dutka PSXE
11 years ago

The PS3 hasn't gotten an inferior multiplat version of anything in quite some time. This isn't 2007.


Last edited by Ben Dutka PSXE on 6/11/2009 12:34:34 PM

RustEDalex
RustEDalex
11 years ago

prototype had a bug in it but that's it,so I guess your right:)

Jawknee
Jawknee
11 years ago

Ben, i wasnt very happy with RE5 on the PS3. I played both versions, and the 360 version i noticed ran a smoother. The particle effects, self shadowing and lighting effects were much better and the frame rate didnt chug as much when turning corners and throwing grenades into large groups. Small things but i did notice it the PS3 version didnt hold as much quality as the 360. The 360 version had more screen tearing but no too noticable.

But your right, most games that have been out lately have been much better. CoD is great on both platforms. Dead Space was identical as well.

shadowpal2
shadowpal2
11 years ago

Hmmm…wow…exclusive projects tend to be better??!?! Really?!?! I mean only great games such as MGS 4, Killzone 2, and Uncharted came out in the past.

And Rockstar just recently said how staying exclusive can help the buildup of a franchise with their new game coming up.

I can't believe this, another developer is stating that exclusive projects cane help development for that game!

This was a while back…but even Nomura-sama and his team said this about FF Versus XIII – http://ps3.ign.com/articles/837/837350p1.html.

napoleon85
napoleon85
11 years ago

If Valve would have used this tone of voice (as per the article above) when commenting their very personal point of views towards the PS3, no crap would have been thrown at them at all. I'm amazed on how Sucker punch manages to have this invaluable business culture. "it's a for profit business and we have a business model that leads us in that direction, but you do have to be careful about being greedy." There are simply almost no companies left that would share these type of values. I really wish them good luck with their next projects and hope they keep the good relationships with Sony.

LimitedVertigo
LimitedVertigo
11 years ago

Who cares what "tone" they used. They were correct and stood behind their reasoning. I'm sorry they didn't sugar coat it for you.

Oyashiro
Oyashiro
11 years ago

What Valve gave was not reason, It was an excuse to hide their inability to adapt to other platforms.

"PS3 is too hard to develop for" stopped being a valid reason a while ago when developers much smaller then Valve began to release and announce games for it.


Last edited by Oyashiro on 6/11/2009 2:27:07 PM

LimitedVertigo
LimitedVertigo
11 years ago

Oyashiro,

Since when does a company have to develop for every platform? Regardless of Valve's reasoning the only thing people are pissed about is it's the PS3 that's getting left out. Take offense at being left out, not at Valve's strategy. There is nothing wrong with not supporting every platform. Valve clearly would rather spend time creating games for the PC and trickle those games down to the 360, as a PS3 owner I do not have a problem with that.


Last edited by LimitedVertigo on 6/11/2009 4:18:59 PM

WorldEndsWithMe
WorldEndsWithMe
11 years ago

They were incorrect, unless they were taking a jab at themselves. No one else is having trouble with the system anymore.

LimitedVertigo
LimitedVertigo
11 years ago

Since they have never developed a game for the system I don't see how you can deny their resistance in wanting to dive into the process.

napoleon85
napoleon85
11 years ago

I didn't take Valve's statement personal at all and hence my feelings aren't hurt (lol…). As I stated on Valve's article, they're just being completely unprofessional (in a business perspective). Unfortunately business relationships are not ensured forever. Hence, Valve better keep a healthy relationship with Microsoft from now on. Throwing away potential opportunities with other companies to the garbage doesn't seem like a smart move these days.
Best regards.


Last edited by napoleon85 on 6/11/2009 6:42:54 PM

Anonymous
Anonymous
11 years ago

I didnt care much for the Infamous demo, but I agree with the statement, either on PS3 or the 360, exclusives will always be better than multiplatform

MarvelZombies
MarvelZombies
11 years ago

I would love to see a developer like this make a multi-platform game and have a higher quality game with better rendering and frame rate on PS3 than 360…that would really stir things up

Evil Incarnate
Evil Incarnate
11 years ago

Personally, I don't wish for crappy ports on anyone. It sucks to waste your hard earned cash on a poor quality product. People have to remember how frustrating it was to constantly hear how crappy your product was compared to the next guy's.

Jawknee
Jawknee
11 years ago

goodness, the Orange Box. Pathetic port to the PS3.

SkantDragon
SkantDragon
11 years ago

As a software engineer who has worked on cross platform software before, I can say… oh yes. Cross platform is an expensive feature that impacts everything you're trying to do. It's always there like shackles.

It's not just a matter of leaving out features one platform can do that another can't. It changes the whole way you architect the system. It gets divided into common code and platform specific code, for instance. And so you're constantly having to deal with that.

I've heard game developers claim that cross platform only increases cost by about 20%. In terms of man hours, I don't doubt it. But there's also a price paid in the overall quality of the title which is very hard to measure. You can only guess how the game development would have gone if the developers didn't have the multiplatform hurdle as well.

Scarecrow
Scarecrow
11 years ago

I will make it my mission to get all the Sly Cooper games(ALWAYS WANTED TO!). Played the first one and have great memories from it.

And they're completely right

It further proves what we like 'bout Playstation and what we used to also like 'bout Nintendo.

The quality of first and second party games! Exclusives that are part of that console and takes advantage of what that console can do.

I also think that the controllers also matter.

For Playstation you can always utilize the d-pad and two VERY COMFORTABLE analog sticks plus two shoulder buttons. It really does matter.

Anyway Infamous!!!

Fane1024
Fane1024
11 years ago

Re: controllers

Agreed. I hate it when games are designed for the 360 (and previously Xbox) controller and then sloppily "ported" to the DS3 (DS2), not taking advantage of the superior layout.

Example: I just played the FEAR2 demo and it had the trigger assigned to R2, rather than R1, because it's in the same position as the trigger on the 360 controller. Problem is, that's not as comfortable/natural on the DS3.

Another example: the last-gen Prince of Persia games didn't use all four shoulder buttons for different action/time control moves because the Xbox and Cube controllers didn't have four corresponding buttons. Instead, they map the "view changes" to those buttons, rather than to L3/R3 or whatever.

Developers: make proper use of the input interface for each system!


Last edited by Fane1024 on 6/11/2009 5:21:52 PM

Ben Dutka PSXE
Ben Dutka PSXE
11 years ago

No more defense of Valve. They've got Half-Life and that's it. L4D if you want to stretch it. They've done next to nothing that has impressed me in about five years, I don't give two sh*** if they ever develop anything for the PS3, and they remain one of the most BIASED studios on earth.

Sucker Punch isn't biased. Valve – and their head moron Gabe Newell – have made some of the most retarded, insulting statements I've ever heard in this industry. No, I don't respect ANYTHING they do.

Fabi
Fabi
11 years ago

Half Life 2 is one of my favorite games of all times. I cannot deny it. But I do hate Valve.

Hexen
Hexen
11 years ago

Half-life 2 was a gem and so was TF2 but when a company (continuously) make stupid statements I can't overlooked it just because I liked their games.

LimitedVertigo
LimitedVertigo
11 years ago

Ben Valve makes games that last for years. TF2 alone will last for another 5 years. You're just pissed because they refuse to develop games for the PS3. There are hundreds of thousands of people every minute playing TF2,L4D, and CSS around the world. Valve must be doing something right. Sorry it doesn't involve the PS3.

I think you're being VERY biased in your reasoning. As an owner of every Sony gaming product and a PC aswell I don't think I'm out of line in this assumption.

Jawknee
Jawknee
11 years ago

actually LimitedVertigo i havent touched Counter Strike or Half Life in years.