Ben-DutkaBefore you answer, let's clarify something:
The term "n00b" shouldn't be used to describe an incompetent individual. In my view, it's simply used to describe someone who isn't used to playing video games, or maybe a certain type of game.
For example, I will forever be a fighting and RTS n00b because I really don't play those genres. I can play them if I have to (got pretty good at DoA and MK at one point) but for the most part, when compared with avid fans of either genre, I'm pretty hopeless. So, considering the difficulty and style of the upcoming PlayStation 4 exclusive Bloodborne , what would you say to an action/RPG n00b to get them to play it? Bear in mind that you'd have to explain the game honestly, so it might be that much harder to make your case.
I'm just wondering if it's even possible. Can you really convince someone who has never played Demon's Souls or Dark Souls to dive into Bloodborne ? Why do I keep thinking the only people buying this games are already hardcore From Software fans? But you need to garner new fans with each new product, right? So, the question remains: If it was up to you to convince a total n00b to play this game, how would you broach and present your argument?
Related Game(s): Bloodborne
Honestly, I'd tell them from the get-go that the game would test you. You have to prepare them thoroughly, and mentally prepare them for the challenge. Diving in could lead to being overwhelming, then at the same time though, you might dissuade them by making them fear the difficulty.
Maybe explain the immersive setting, and highlight the sense of achievement. I don't know. The main thing is to get them to accept the challenge without frightening/overwhelming them with it. It would be hard…
Tried demons souls to see what all this rpg stuff was about, was slow and boring as hell, don't even think there was a plot, to each their own though
The Souls games tell their story and lore very subtly. You have to really read into a lot of things to get it all, like item descriptions.
There is no plot. Just pure immersion.
A plot is a planned series of events that occur in no particular order other than having a start, an end, and a middle that uses a variety of points to build to the end. It's different from "story" in that it doesn't develop or establish things like characters, symbolism, set pieces, or structure any dialogue or narrative.
But DeS/DkS definitely have plots.
Dictionary.com:
2. Also called storyline. the plan, scheme, or main story of a literary or dramatic work, as a play, novel, or short story.
We can all pretend we know what we're talking about it's fun to see someone try so hard though
Nope. Dictionary.com (lolz) doesn't have a degree in anything related to the arts, nor is it a legit English dictionary.
I do have a degree in theatre as well as a legit English dictionary. I am right. You are wrong. No one in the literary world would agree with that.
The Oxford dictionary (The real dictionary) defines it as:
"The main events of a play, novel, movie, or similar work, devised and presented by the writer as an interrelated sequence"
Don't bring a gun to a pen fight. I bet you write papers and quote the google, too.
Tip: The Oxford dictionary is also online… only it doesn't have tons of malware and illegitimate definitions.
Last edited by Underdog15 on 3/23/2015 2:39:37 PM
There was a plot, it is established in the first cutscene if you didn't get up to go to the kitchen and grab a bag of extreme heat doritos and code red mountain dew.
Next the Monumental further explains the plot, item descriptions explain the lore and further build the backstory of the world.
Lastly the game is about your character interacting in the world, the plot is will you become the next Demon or will you lul the old one back to sleep and get rid of the fog.
I find it incredible that there are people who can actually beat that first encounter before you die for the first time. (You die anyway in the plot, but still)
the unfolding of events in a dramatic or literary work <wrote novels in which the plot was always subordinate to the characterizations>
Synonyms plot, story, story line
I don't know if merriam works as a real dictionary or not but why don't you enlighten us as to what a "story" is, sounds like a useful degree you got there
lol w/e man. Just no. This isn't a debate. You're arguing 2+2 not being 4.
"Synonym" doesn't mean "different word; exact same meaning"
It means similar and sometimes interchangeable and rarely "same". For example, a synonym for "sports" is "Pastime". They are interchangeable and can hint to something similar, but they do -not- own the same definition and there are instances of use where one would be exclusive in and unto themselves. For example, "I have a pastime" -could- mean I play sports. It could also mean I collect stamps. The only time synonyms are the exact same are in things like "joy" or "happiness". And even then, that's not exactly the same thing. Similar and often interchangeable… but not always appropriate to exist in place of one another.
In fact, thesauruses are not even used to deliver definition. They're used to help inspire eclectic writing and help dispel repetition.
And perhaps most importantly of all, "story" is not a primary synonym of "plot"…. like… in -any- thesaurus. Even on your "dictionary" website from before… (way to be consistent, bad dictionary website) You can make a case for "storyline", but that's a modern word that came into play when writing out blocking and more elements than merely "plot". And it -still- doesn't mean "story".
I can enlighten you about what a story is if you like, but hopefully you should be able to extrapolate from my definition of plot up above with the examples I gave in how it differentiates from "story".
Last edited by Underdog15 on 3/23/2015 6:00:02 PM
good choice
I'm actually surprised more people don't know. Learning about the difference between plot and story dates back as far as Aristotle. "Plot" is a modern word, but he referred to it as the difference between "story" and "discourse".
Discourse, according to Aristotle, is a measurement of units that are selected from pieces of the story and arranged in what he calls mythos.
It's actually super interesting stuff (I think), but there's easy-to-access literature out there on the stuff if you want to learn more.
But yes. While related, there is very much a difference between plot and story.
I wouldn't wish this Dante-esque torment on my worst enemy.
Just hand them the controller and tell them "if he dies he dies"….
Sweet mother. Was that a Rocky IV reference?
Heck yes!
showing them a video of an unpredictable death by giant pig video is one thing not to do.
Last edited by Temjin001 on 3/23/2015 12:52:37 AM
Lawlz…
Still scarred by Flamelurker in Demon's Souls… Not sure if I can summon enough courage to jump back into the nightmare.
To a noobie I would say it is hard, truly hard and you really feel alone and abandoned but it gives you a sense of battered accomplishment greater than any other game series out there.
In the Tower of Latria Zone 2 (the high towers with gargoyles after the false whatsherface boss)up the staircase in the main tower initially blocked up with that large mass of ew,there is a spot after a point where the wall is gone. Walking left off the ledge will drop you on another ledge if you don't fall too far. You'll find Ostrava/The Prince of Boletaria's Rune Sword and Shield. They deal great magic damage for a physical weapon, and make that fight easier…
Last edited by Sol on 3/23/2015 3:28:59 AM
Thanks for the tip Sol!
On a side note, I chuckled a bit because that info is an example of something I might not say out loud at a family reunion or something. haha
Honestly the best way to get anyone into anything is to show them you having fun in it… Plain and simple, then they'd be willing to at least try. Hell, one guy ALMOST got e to play a sports title…
If they see you struggle they will start to dread the idea. If you don't use only the basics, they'll dissuade themselves and say they can't do it or it's too complicated…
Just have fun, relax, and show em a few cool things, like cool environs and graphics, or the way you rip into the cleric beast with your hand after a well timed shot. They'll get curious, and your job is done.
First 30 minutes of Demon's Souls made me sold the game.
Alright mates, convince me to play this!!
Nah save your time, I would never play Bloodborne even if it gets 100% on Metacritic.
This just isn't my cup of tea.
"What? You don't wanna play a difficult game? What are you…a chicken?"
In all seriousness, I would say something around the lines of: If you enjoy creating a story that caters around you, the player, and in that story you create the actions and going-ons in the world around you. You die over and over, and its all for a reason you end up deciding for yourself. If you are goal driven, play it. If you enjoy getting used to a unique combat system unlike anything else that allows you to fight other human players, play it.
I've already convinced most people I know both on the PSN and people I personally know to play the Souls games. My mission is complete.
You don't.
If they haven't gotten into it themselves then it's not going to be a good time.
was half jk btw
yeah i realised before i read the part saying that it was a joking tone in there so i chuckled
I would just tell them to move slowly and to remember that dying is a big part of the game. That usually helps people get started
I just straight up told a buddy "You're supposed to die a lot".
Anyone who I try and get into the game, I've gotten about 3 out of 5 people hooked on the game, and it was simply by saying look the games not that hard, I'm being honest. You don't need twitch reflexes, and there is always a solution to your problem if you pay enough attention.
I also tell them to not take death as a failure in this game, that it is just a tool for learning. If you died you must immediately ask yourself what you did wrong, not what the game did what YOU did wrong. If you die again ask yourself what you think the game wants you to do, are you in a higher area than you should be? Are you using magic when the enemy is resistant to it, or melee when an enemy has high phs defense?
The biggest tip is to not act like a victim of the game when you die, but ask yourself what you did wrong. If you do this one thing you will slowly start to fall into the mindset you need to beat the game, and everything becomes a lot more manageable.
That's exactly the case with NG. It was considered one of the most brutally hard games of its time. There's a definite learning curve, yes, but the pay off of having a game hold you highly accountable for your actions is nice. It helps prevent thoughtless button mashing, where you actually have to use your brain to fight. It's a lot like being successful in competive fighting games. These sort of games really make you appreciate the depth and thought of the actions that goes behind its design.
Edit: I find it boring when games dump piles of combos and moves into their game while giving them little thought behind their purpose other than to look cool.
Last edited by Temjin001 on 3/23/2015 12:10:26 PM
I like stealth action games like Splinter Cell for the same reason. Sure the learning curve is high and the consequence of thoughtlessness results in death but the pay off justifies it in a way other games don't.
Edit: I remember I played Splinter Cell to death on Xbox and later I bought the ps2 version of the original to play the new exclusive snow plant mission. I think I beat that level nearly on my first try. And not because it was any easier than other missions but because I was an experienced guy who knew the game system very well.
Last edited by Temjin001 on 3/23/2015 12:26:06 PM
Yeah you really know when a combo system is good or not, based on weather or not you are forced to use different combo strings for different enemies.
So many times in games you can just fall back on one combo, and it makes the game feel boring.
DMC does a good job because you can fall back on easy combos but you will get a low style rating.
The first god of war was alright but I did find myself only really needing to use square square triangle most of the time 😛
I want to go back and try the original 3D Ninja Gaiden, I played it on Xbox when it was released but never beat it. Which NG game would you recommend is the best? I didn't really care for 3 but I only played the demo.
As an action game NG Sigma 2 is the best. As an action-adventure NG is the best. Though, I think I'd recommend starting with the first game and then proceeding to the second.
The first game has a couple bosses where the camera is always locked onto a boss that flies around a smaller room, which makes it frustrating until you learn to work with it.
If you end up liking both then do try NG3 Razor's Edge. It makes some changes to the combat system that make it feel different but still unique to NG. It was smart retooling. Though, NG3's art design and general level, boss, and enemy design lacks compared to either of it's predecessors.
Awesome man, I'll get Ninja Gaiden Black and Pick up Sigma 2 after. This is of course when I get into a gaming drought which wont happen for sometime >.<
"Do you like a challenge?"
*waves copy of Bloodborne in your face*
"Not really…i prefer my games nice and eas…."
*walks away, disgusted*
"Do you like a challenge?"
*waves copy of Bloodborne in your face*
"Not really…i prefer my games nice and eas…."
*slaps person with copy of Bloodborne*
^_^"
Well this is me. I've never been able to get into full blown RPGs. I've tried some of the best from Kingdom Hearts to Final Fantasy. But Bloodborne does holds my interest. Only thing is, I can't tell if it's more action than rpg. I like some games that have RPG elements to an extent. I've viewed a lot of gameplay trailers but can't really get a good grip on what to expect. Never played any of the Souls games because I knew they weren't my thing…I need some form of info to help me decide.
I'm not sure you can unless you know this is a game which would suit their personality.
I for one really would not enjoy it unless it had easier settings. I always play on easy or normal settings and get really frustrated if I die and have to go back over parts I've already done.
i feel ya man but that does turn me off as much bit i get you totally
idk i guess i'd agree with @Sol that would probably be the best, you need to prepare them for the challenge that lies ahead that is the most important thing other wise it'll be a complete turn of.
one prop i would give it is increasing the pace a bit as most people would be ready for some of the slower paced stuff like in the other dark souls cos i know some people won't play certain games i they are too slow that just how alot of people are.
happy gaming