Ben-DutkaI know that sometimes things get lost in translation. I also respect the hell out of Hideo Kojima, so in no way am I accusing him of intentionally lying.
However, I keep mulling over a recent statement of his, when he was comparing Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain to the prelude, Ground Zeroes . He said the full game was "more than 200 times bigger" than Ground Zeroes . This comment has received a lot of attention, mostly because many gamers don't quite understand it.
Perhaps it's just exaggerating for the sake of exaggeration. It's like saying, "I have a million things to do," right? But if it's merely exaggeration, "200" seems like an odd number to pick, doesn't it? If he's being literal, though, more questions arise: Is he talking about length in terms of hours? This can't really be true, because even if Ground Zeroes is only two hours in length, it would mean The Phantom Pain is over 400 hours long. No, that's not it. Hence, he must be talking about sheer size, right? As in, the size of the world?
That doesn't really seem feasible, either, though. It also doesn't seem possible that there are over 200 times as many missions; even if there's only one mission in Ground Zeroes , that would mean there will be over 200 missions in The Phantom Pain . I suppose that's plausible, but even so… Also, don't forget that Kojima actually said he was "afraid" that the game will be too big for gamers to clear. I mean…really? We've become used to some pretty gigantic games, Kojima. No, they don't usually come from Japanese developers but trust me, they're out there and they're massive.
Actually, could that be it? Being a Japanese designer, is he simply not acknowledging the humongous size of titles in franchises like The Elder Scrolls and Fallout ? That's sort of insulting to assume, though, isn't it? I don't know; I just don't have a good explanation for that "200x" statement, that's all.
Related Game(s): Metal Gear Solid V: The Phantom Pain
I agree, frankly, ever since the "2-hours" debacle of Ground Zeroes, Kojima's twitter usage has seen an upsurge. I've been following him for a over a year now and part of me is starting to wish he'd come up with these types of statements less often…
Last edited by Victor321 on 3/6/2014 10:31:23 PM
If anyone has earned the right to make ridiculous statements it's him. He tends to back up the claims he makes. But I think he's far to vague about it for it to carry much weight. I've put 400hrs into more than one game but it was multiple playthroughs.
Maybe he's talking about ways to play. Ground Zeroes is supposedly locked into the time of day that the missions take place, while The Phantom Pain is supposed to have an unlocked span of time. So, perhaps playing through a mission is markedly different from playing through it during the day. Perhaps it's possible to enter into a mission as the guards change, making it slightly easier. Then factor in the ability to go in guns blazing or do so stealthily. The ability to kill or play completely non-lethally. The options in TPP are going to be vastly more expansive than they are in GZ, so odds are that that ties into it.
Otherwise he's implying that the clear time of TPP is going to be over 2000 hours, with 400 hours of story progression alone, which is simply unrealistic. I think that Kojima feels as though he has to embark on damage control for MGSV, and if that is the case, I don't really understand why.
I still wish that TPP wasn't a part of MGS. Learning that it was really disappointed me, and I still haven't gotten over it.
Why does it disappoint you that it's a part of MGS? I'm not really a fan of the series so I'm not aware of any issues, other than time/price.
Not that it is MGSV, but based on that original trailer. It gave off this very survival/horror type vibe, as well as having some very abstract imagery and I think that a game based on the sort of weirdness and questioning of reality and circumstance could have been utterly fabulous as a new IP.
Some of that may very well be in place for MGSV, but it can't be the same as I was originally envisioning for The Phantom Pain.
Hmm, good points…and since I'm not really a fan of the series now I'm disappointed too.
Could Kojima just be just referring to the map sizes between these 2 games???
Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but I thought that Ground Zeroes is just being set in mostly 1 main area, & that Phantom Pain was to be in a multitude of different locales.
I also think it's the map size. In one of the trailer, I think Big Boss used 3 types of transportation. So it's huge. And huge maps equals to many ways of how you approach the missions, thus more time spent playing. So it's all of the above.
Huge map + more ways to approach the mission = more playtime.
But the most important is the story. It's Kojima and it is Metal Gear. The story will be epic good.
Oh My God can't wait for Ground Zeroes and The Phantom Pain.
Just saw PS4 gameplay on youtube looks absolutely amazing.
I think Kojima's dream has been finally realised that is stealth infiltration.
Ground Zeroes complete main mission and you've only completed 9% of the game,so it's not two hours.
"We've become used to some pretty gigantic games, Kojima. No, they don't usually come from Japanese developers but trust me, they're out there and they're massive."
Have you ever in your life completed a Yakuza game Mr.Ben?
Story titbit : The Moby Dick story is related to the revenge aspect of the game.
Last edited by Kiryu on 3/6/2014 11:50:15 PM
"Have you ever in your life completed a Yakuza game Mr.Ben?"
Uh, yeah, I have. None are a fraction the size or length of games like The Elder Scrolls, Fallout, GTA, etc.
Search for the uncompressed graphics comparison video. YouTube does it no justice.
I disagree, Ben. The 'Yakuza' games are definitely shorter than Bethesda titles (as are almost all titles), but each seems to be longer than the one before. And I think 'Yakuza 4' is longer than every 'Grand Theft Auto', save for 'San Andreas.' So to say that they aren't even "a fraction the size or length" of those titles seems a faulty statement.
Really which Yakuza game did you do a 100%?
Bought the Japanese version of Yakuza 5 a year ago and still haven't completed a 100% man Five cities to explore.Huge!
Last edited by Kiryu on 3/7/2014 1:13:08 AM
I'm not talking about 100%. I'm just talking about finishing them.
Finishing a game means completing it , completing it means a 100% of what the game offers.
I don't think that argument holds up, Ben, since the main story is definitely the shortest aspect of the titles you listed. Like 'Yakuza 4', they're all significantly beefed up by the amount of optional content they provide.
"Finishing a game means completing it , completing it means a 100% of what the game offers."
That's stupid. Last thanksgiving I finished my meal. You can't say I didn't just because I didn't have the gravy.
"Finishing a game means completing it , completing it means a 100% of what the game offers."
I'm sorry if I don't go by your own weird definitions.
As far as the missions go, there could easily be over 200 missions, as long as side missions count. Anyone play Peace Walker? Including all types of missions, there were around 150 or more missions, even though a lot were boss battles, then slightly harder versions of the same boss.
Regardless, I'm almost positive that the original quote was about the map's size. Ground Zeroes isn't supposed to be too big.
I personally, and not to offend the Kojima mafia, but I think he's just garnering hype for the game.
I don't blame him though after reading what some people think and all that this is the type of thing people want to be hearing from the big boss.
On a side note, I'm still completely confused about his comments about the two consoles last year and his sudden change in heart.
I do look forward to MGSV though. Since I haven't played any other MGS game I wonder if this is a continuation of 4 or if its a new storyline. I know you play as Big Boss though. whatever, its going to be great. The game is so damn pretty as well.
The "200 times bigger" comment throws me off as well, but I try to just focus on Kojima's reliability. If he's being literal, then size would be my guess, really going all-out on the open world aspect. It would make sense that 'Ground Zeroes' takes place in a much smaller, more controlled area and 'The Phantom Area' opens up into a huge map.
To be honest, during my time in the PS sphere I've hardly heard anything but nonsense from that man.
haha yeah pretty much this.
It should be said that I entered the PS world a year into the PS3 lifespan. So I missed out on whatever wise stuff he might have said or done before that point in time.
yeah it's fine, Beam. He's always been kinda like the gaming industry's mad scientist. Says crazy and weird things, but invents these pieces of work we can't take our eyes off of.
Hehe – cool.
@Ben Elder scrolls skyrm main story can be beaten under 4 hours
like you said only thing that counts is beating the main story
elder scrolls the only reason it lasts so long is the thousands of side quests the main story is short
GTA ill admit has a long story but the main story can be completed in 24 hours or less
Fall out not sure how long it is if you skip all the sidequests
as for Kojima hes blowing smoke up your @$$es to save his face
If it means you could easily spend 400 hours on it, that would be awesome to me. I have about 220 hours into Skyrim and once I pick up the dlc on sale, I'll probably add another 300-400 hours into it because skyrim is one of those games that just seems like it was made for me.
If the new metal gear could be that huge, I could spend just as much time on it as mgs4 was the best tactical stealth 3rd person game I've played and an open world version could easily be a huge favorite for me to go back to again and again.
Who sits and wonder if Kojima means what he says? Obviously MGS is his baby so he puts his heart and soul into it. I'm sure Konami tells him to say XYZ but come on let's move on.
i could see it being 200x bigger… I mean Im sure Skyrims world is 200 times bigger than ground zeroes and THAT game/world exists soooo why cant phantom pain have one similar in size?
Because Kojima has already said the world won't be that big. It's a mistake to call it a "sandbox" game, according to him.