This isn't a rhetorical question; we're just interested to see what people think. Everyone always complains that big, mega-global corporations never listen to John Q. Taxpayer, but gamers have always been quite vocal in their requests and complaints (thank the Internet for that). The question is, do you believe Sony listens to their targeted audience?
Well, we could look at the evidence. First off, many are demanding a price cut for the PlayStation 3 and Sony has yet to deliver, but in this case, it simply may not be a feasible option. As much as they may want to drop the price of the system, they just went through a major corporate shuffle, they lost $3 billion last year, and they only recently managed to lower the manufacturing cost on the PS3 to about $445/machine. This means they're still losing money on every PS3 sold, but a $45 loss is far more agreeable in this recession than a $145 loss, which would occur if the price of the system fell to $299. We're only theorizing, here, but it seems logical, right? In this case, it may not be a matter of Sony "listening" to the fans, as the entire situation may be dictated by numbers and nothing else.
But outside of that- recent examples have included fan demand for the return of rumble, which Sony responded to with the Dual Shock 3. Then there's the demand for a better Network, and over the past few years, we've seen immense growth and expansion on the PSN (ranging from the Store to online gaming). The latter may have happened, anyway, but it was a common complaint amongst Sony fans, so it may stand to reason that Sony heard the outcry. On the other hand, we sense there is still a large group of gamers that demand backwards compatibility in the PS3 and Sony really isn't interested in entertaining the thought. Or at least, they show no visible interest, and it could be difficult to ascertain the size of the group that values b/c. As for customer service, we can and will say that beyond any shadow of a doubt, our experiences have always been excellent. Microsoft's customer service, on the other hand, is typically a nightmare.
Many will complain that Sony lost a ton of third-party exclusives going into this generation, and that likely remains a valid point. They didn't really listen to the loyalists who stuck by Sony through the PS1 and PS2 years, only to find their favorite franchises had made their way to other platforms. But much like the price drop issue, this may be more of a numbers issue. When the PS3 first launched, the user base was tiny, the system was expensive, developers were confused (as they always are early on with PlayStation hardware), and Microsoft had a ton of cash. It couldn't have been too difficult to purchase timed exclusives when the publishers examined the situation. The only thing is, Sony's policy of never buying exclusives does tend to clash with Microsoft's willing desire to do exactly that. Some Sony fans say they should step up and compete for exclusives. Look at the possibility that Mass Effect 2 won't be on the PS3…
These are just a few thoughts to chew on, but in your experience, would you say that Sony stays in touch with its fans? Or are they more removed than they should be? It's an interesting question, really.
I really think they are listening to the fans, i dont see why not because they have already provided much of what people have been requesting…
To me it seems like the PS3 itself is in a beta phase. They seem to be listening to what the consumer wants, regardless of how it seems…
Last edited by ThugNificent101 on 3/17/2009 10:43:48 PM
I believe they do listen. They also gave us trophies and gamer cards. It almost seems like they'd give us BC but something strange is holding them back. It'll come though. Price drops on the other hand don't matter. You can't let your customer dictate the price of goods. That's just silly. The price will drop when it's feasible to do so.
Seems to me they are doing everything possible to please the fans, some requests just can't be honored but I feel like they are trying. That other company doesn't seem to give a flying eff about the gamers since it actively tries to sabotage them.
Last edited by WorldEndsWithMe on 3/17/2009 10:54:13 PM
@WorldEndsWithMe enough said.
I think they do. Many of the things (Such as price drop or timed exclusives) are just simply out of reach for Sony to control. They lost nearly $3 billion, and they are still losing $45 on each system sold. One might say, Sony is a very rich company.. and that is true.. but does anyone recall all the recalls Sony had to make on notebooks and PSP's just because of the batteries that were manufactured in that time period? I am surprised they ONLY lost $3 billion. I just think they need to do whatever they need to do in certain areas. They certainly don't tell us how to do our jobs, why should we tell them how to do theirs? At least they listen to requests they know they can do (Such as the rumble, after a long conflict with the company that had the rights to it, Sony finally gave in and made a deal with them after requests for it's loyalists) Now… let's see… What company did nothing about the RRoD on the X360? Microsoft. I doubt Sony would ever let that be on their machine, 33% failure rate.
We have a right to tell them how to do their jobs because we are the ones that buy their products.
Two words: Playstation blog
They do listen.
In fact MLB 2009 is a PRIME example of that.
Many of its fans wanted time of day, and now it's there. They really listen to their fans. The commercial for it shows it.
But yeah overall SCEA listens the most. SCEE? Hmmm probably, SCEJ? Maybe.
Tricky question since SCE has 4 branches. SCEA is my fave, they really seem to care 'bout what matters, quality and kicking ass. SCEE has become a big powerhouse though.
SCEE, we get the cheapest games I think, head over to play.com and you will see what I mean. The PS3 on release the games were £50 now they are about £40 in most retail stores and on play I picked up lbp for 17.99 sf4 for £27 hell even kz2 for £30 on release. I dont know why but ps3 exclusives are very cheap here in the UK. My cousin in Australia asks me to post games to him from here (we also had two major retailers go under woolworths and zavvi – zavvi is still running but its dying a slow death. So have had games going for ridiculously cheap – woolworths sold out of ps3s so fast it was unbelievable same with zavvi the ps3s literally flew out of the stores with the discounts.)
Plus in the UK, If your launch ps3 died they were taking it back on the same day they took the broken ps3 they would drop through a brand new 60gig ps3. No down time and a brand new ps3 (This happened to my bro his bluray drive packed up, mine is still going strong launch ps3). SCEE cannot be faulted. Also stuff like PlayTV that we have here..
It will be great when we get the film service in the UK as well.
woolworths was always cheap on everything, but games and movies. But still, no town is complete without woolworths over here. i think we should have a 1 min silence in rememberance of the company
SCEA, SCEJ and SCEE are all under control by SCE. Theyre just there to make it possible for Sony to do what they need to do. Mind you, Europe, North America and Asia all have different laws and regulations on many things. But when it comes down to whos in commands, it's all Sony.
Sony listens to its customers but as far as b/c and a price drop thats a business decision. You have to look at the economy, they cant really afford to lose anymore money right now.
i don't think Sony will ever have a lack of money problem
So far I have no complaints about how Sony is handling their business they're giving us most of what we're asking for, I think they're being very calm in this rough economy and are delivering the goods on a steady basis
PSN ID Biggest_GMoney
They absolutely do, it's just that not everything we gamers demand is feasible for them.
As much as they want to please their audience (and of course they do because it means more money for them), they are still a corporation that has to crunch the numbers. When Henry Ford tried to look out for the consumers instead of his shareholders, the Supreme Court screwed him.
I can't stand it when gamers talk as if Sony is a horrible company simply because they wont grant them every request they make, as if that is the only factor they take into consideration.
In my experience Sony seems to at least attempt to connect with its fans. But I cannot say for sure because I have had no real problems with Sony products. There has been no need for me to do or say anything. I would say Sony does what it can do and attempts what it can't. With that there is no need for me to demand anything of them.
I think Sony does listen, but only to some extent. I think Sony has a hard time still in this day in age finding out what most consumers do want, over things that only a few really care about.
Also, i think Sony is slow to finally make things happen that they feel the majority of the fans want.
The real question should be, do People listen to Sony, when they are listening to you? I mean seriously, they have done so much for PS3 users, for "FREE" since I bought my PS3, ask Scarecrow, Im sure he remembers we didn't have anything like this when we first got ours. Back then we thought that was some good stuff, they have since blown me away with everything they have given us. It's just a matter of if the people are being to greedy to realize.
Aye aye
Proud to have gotten my ps3 in early 2007
Sweetest thing ever, it was a great boy with a great few games and great online.
I never understood people's complaints 'bout online. It's always been fine and stable for me. The little features don't matter to me. All I want is to be able to play the game online. The other things are just bonuses which one can do without.
Anyway the console is worth every penny, strong, has never died, runs smoothly, and great exclusives.
Well their customer service rep for MLB 09 is sure an A** people all over are complaining about the the base running controls for RTTS and he basically said screw you there not fixing them.
He's a PR guy, not a dev, I guess with enough complaints he could relay the message to the devs, but it might not be that major yet. This is prime example how people ask for so much, seems a little greedy to be calling him an A$$ though, huh?
Resident Evil 5 proves that some control issues that a developer refused change will not deter people from buying a game.
i think they do a great job listening to customers. but as far as a price drop goes….. i think its possible. console price drops a little but number of sales would skyrocket. when console numbers rise so does software sales. plus some happier consumers might just cause a lot less “anti-sony†negative feedback. voila, everyones happy. it may take a bit longer for profit to be shown but if the console demand rises wont the component price drop. eventually theyd be back to where they r now but with a larger fan base and much less negativity surrounding the product. but its just a thought
"In this case, it may not be a matter of Sony "listening" to the fans, as the entire situation may be dictated by numbers and nothing else."… Ben business is only ever dictated by numbers, so unfortunately we don't win, it doesn't matter how much we pine for price drops.
Generally I think Sony do listen, however they have never made it that clear where to direct your complaint requests too. I think the PS forums (on the official PlayStation website) would probably be a good start, but you never quite know who is reading and taking notes of the suggestions people post there. I wonder what internal processes they have to vet suggestions and ideas.
If I were managing this feedback and analysis methodology for Sony, I would create a special section of their site for the simple task of getting gamers and technologists to generate ideas… lots and lots of them; free of charge!. Sony could be leveraging alot of peoples' brains for nothing if there was a clear way to do it and a very clear of actually seeing if anything is being done about those ideas as a collective. I would consider attributing prizes, free hardware and games, to ideas that are used, the most effective ones that are market changing…
Again, Sony being a corporate, you feel the overpowering sense of control they have, however I always believe in the "market"; and the community should be encouraged to give as many ideas as they can, get rewarded for the ideas used; and they should also permit more development on the console for "bedroom programmers". I believe deeply that HOME for example should be a PS community incubator… they haven't opened up HOME quick enough…
There will be plenty of good ideas, from XMB GUI enhancements, to enhancements made to HOME and its menus, to new I.P. ideas etc…
Sony needs to open up and listen up… and give the community a clear path to submit ideas and track their progress through the system. It will be better to act on a "collective" idea that is consistant to one particular theme, such as the in-game music feature.
It would probably be easier to total up ideas around specific themes (like the in-game music feature), and then create a vote for that feature, and a number of others… every quarter a vote could be held, with the community voting on what ideas are the strongest… Sony can then pipeline these into the firmware development or instruct their studios to include features that make game playing more fun and flexible.
It would be nice to see the community really influencing Sony's development strategy.
Who agrees?
Q!
"i am home"
Last edited by Qubex on 3/18/2009 1:37:25 AM
Ben that's a good question you got there. I personally think there's only a so much a company can do. I mean look at what they've made the ps3 now. The firmware updates, the psn updates (even though the euro version is lacking quite a bit) and the games they produce. At the end of the day a company has to answer to it's shareholders and keep them happy and yes the way to do that is to keep consumers happy and hence listen to them but Sony can and only will undertake operations that are feasible to them as a company.
So yaa I think they are one company that do listen to gamers (the other being capcom) and reply quite often but sometimes gamers do get selfish and ask for too much. All the arguments that support why sony can't always listen to us are already mentioned above. Yes we lost exclusives and the so called loyal companies to the playstation left us but I do see quite an intelligent bunch of gamers here so I think we all would agree and understand when I speak on the behalf of the dev's and quote 'It's nothing personal, It's just business'.
good day!
Sony is on the right track. They care but they can´t possible do all the things at once. Anyway PS3 Owners Group is growing faster than others and in the end it will come out to a PS2 like success. They acted very smart so far.
Go Sony, Go Sony! 🙂
I sure hope Sony listens once more to its fans and includes a second analog stick on the PSP (for the PSP2).
That would make third person and first person shooters very enjoyable on the portable.
Of course they do. They're doing everything they can to make up for their arrogance.
People who hate them with a passion are only angry because of their arrogance in 2006/2007 and are unwilling to give them a secopnd chance.
They listen to fans…….eventually.
If nothing else, Sony has learned a tough lesson. Namely, that brand name loyalty/recognition alone ain't gonna cut it.
That's good news for us. They've improved the firmware and PSN immensely since launch. They listen to fans, but only to the extent they have to.
Diggity Dan, I think I have to agree with you there.
Q!
"i am home"
That's a good point. They've justified the high price with "People think the Playstation brand is worth the money," time and time again. And I know a LOT of people who went from PS2 to 360 and not PS3.
At the very least, I'm happy that Sony didn't cut any corners in making the PS3 a beastly machine. I'm not sure if anybody cried out "We want a machine that plays blu-ray discs, DVDs, stores photos, music, and videos, and a bunch of other stuff besides games," when the PS3 was in development, but we got it.
All we need now is a good gamer card and web site and we're good to go!
well, as a recent YLOD victim… I'm pretty jaded at the moment. Real close to throwing in the towel with Sony. I'm not fond of paying $700 for a paperweight. My biggest complaint at the moment is that if your PS3 dies you lose everything. It doesn't matter if your HDD is fine, the data is completely unrecoverable. I just don't get why we can't swap HDD's between consoles and recover our saves. Seriously, even the 360 can do that.
Sony has dodged every question I've asked them, not once giving me a straight answer. All i get are long winded letters that basically say 'no comment'. I just want an answer, why can't i recover the data on my PS3 HDD when the console is what failed (fried mobo).
Sony wants to charge me $180 to send me a refurb with a formatted HDD. No way man, I'm more likely to sell it for parts and just quit. go back to PS2 until they get their sh** straight.
Did you lose all of the PSN games that you downloaded or do they let you download them again? I don't have a PS3 yet, that is why I am asking.
This seems strange Gumbi. How can you not just swap the HDD into a new PS3 and have all your stuff still there? I've never heard of this and hope someone can clarify. I do think YLOD or whatever is REALLY wrong only happens to a tiny minority.
Either way, it's a good reminder to back up my save games on a usb stick.
Last edited by Alienange on 3/18/2009 10:00:31 AM
I feel your pain. My blu drive died on me,i was so pissed off (halfway through Killzone 2 and i just got Rez 5).But at least customer care told me that refubs are only given in extreme cases so i really hope they just replace my blu drive and send it back.
Is there any reason you can't take your working HDD out before you send the machine in, then just insert it into the replacement unit? Will Sony slap your wrist for that?
-Arvis
Yeah! I totally agree as I own one of those 600.00 paperweights. Look at their track record. Sony is basically greedy, and it is all about shareholders and profits as with any business. The consumer really has nothing to do with desicions. If all these people that are all about Sony and the PS3 had bricked systems, which is a very large number, to many, they would change their attitudes too. 600.00 paperweights suck!
Hey Gumbi,
Sony use an encrypted fat32 partition from what I have read. Basically all of the data on the ps3 section is encrypted. This is why you cant access your data.
Dont forget you can run linux on the ps3 its probably a safety measure to stop people being able to hack the ps3 that is one reason, the other is to also stop piracy if you can easily access the data on the partition why not download games dont install find the download and dump onto the net for any one else to grab ? I can understand why they have done it.
What you could try and do..
Use something like norton ghost or possibly dd on linux.
This will make an image of the disk that you can then dump onto another 60 gig drive. Or you could just get another 60 gig hdd plug that into the ps3 and submit that to them. When you get your new ps3 plug in the original 60 gig and see what happens.
I havent tried this. The encryption could well be linked to a specific system id and the key is derived from either a chip or a specific identifier within the bios which is unique to each ps3 or the key is assembled on your username. I dont know if any one has tested this out. I would bet there is some hardware lock in each ps3 probably has a unique id (key) stored somewhere which is linked to the drive that becomes the key to unlock the data on the drive.
The encryption may be dependent on your username / password. Which would mean just plugging your old drive into a new ps3 would be fine..
Do you have any friends near you that have a ps3 ? might be worth trying to plug your hdd into their ps3 and seeing what happens, its an interesting test.
I am surprised they charge you in the US, they have been replacing with brand new ones here in the UK. Are you sure they will send you a refurb ? Here when they pick up the dead one they replace it with a new one there and then and for free :/.. I only know 1 person that has had it fail on them (the bluray drive packed up )
PSXMAX:
You wont lose any of your games that you have paid for. It is all stored under your PSN account so when you log back in you can re-download everything that you have bought no issues there.
Crawdaddy:
The failure rate of the ps3 has so far been about the expected amount of any electronic components. Its failure rate is actually very good considering its complexity.
My bro got the same yellow light symptom and his PS3 wasn't that old 80 Gig 4 usb port model, And he never really even played it that much. Very weird. Sony would have fixed it but he didn't have the receipt, so it was considered out of warranty, and wanted 150$ to send it in. I actually was able to get it to boot after a few reset methods and powering on and off. But it was really laggy and kept freezing to play games.
Oh believe me, i've tried just about everything. I tried swapping with a friends PS3, it wants to format it. I tried loading it in an external drive via USB on another PS3, but it doesn't read it. I tried connecting the USB external to a PC running windows and a couple brands of linux and it will usually recognize that there is a drive attached, but reads it as unallocated because it doesn't recognize the file system.
vdopey, thanks for the comments/advice. But The PS3 uses a hardware signature to ensure you only use an HDD that was formatted on that specific console. I thought of ghosting the image, but if another PS3 wont read this one, why would it read a copy of it?
The Sony rep i talked to when i called said that it's highly unlikely they would fix mine and send it back, she said they'd send a refurb as soon as they received notice that i had sent my busted one in. So they're not even considering repairing it for me.
Oh well, I've learned my lesson. Don't buy first gen anymore, and always backup your sh**.
Last edited by gumbi on 3/19/2009 12:29:58 PM
Gumbi,
I'm sorry dude, but thanks for the info. I know for definite now the encryption is dependent on the hardware, which is a shame..
If you could find out where the encryption key is stored, you would be able to transfer it onto another ps3 and get the drive to work, but only Sony would know how to do it ? I want a dev kit, because that sort of sh** could be worked out…
"Sony is basically greedy, and it is all about shareholders and profits as with any business. The consumer really has nothing to do with decisions."
What's your point? Not much of a Revelation here Crawdaddy.
Last edited by pillz81 on 3/20/2009 3:08:51 PM
No, because if Sony listened to us we would have backwards capability in every PS3.
No, if Sony did'nt listen to us we would be having backwards compatability.Sony is keeping things interesting;if the ps3 drops by $100 then its over for ms and nintendo.
"Did you lose all of the PSN games that you downloaded or do they let you download them again? I don't have a PS3 yet, that is why I am asking."
You keep all your content from the PS Store, although you'll have to call Cust Service to get back movies you've bought. I jusy had my ps3 stolen and bought a repalcement last night. All my stuff was there at the PS Store history, pretty nice.
Thanks for the info. Sorry to hear that your PS3 got stolen. Isn't there some way to track your stolen PS3 when it logs on to the PSN, like an IP address.
Last edited by psxmax on 3/18/2009 10:06:27 AM
I read somewhere that if you have auto sign in enabled you can work with Sony so when you're ps3 goes online Sony will get its position and call the cops,that is, assuming the thief wont delete your profile and deactivate your account on the console
Yea I'm not too sure about those comments gumbi. I understand it sucks to have to pay for a refurbished ps3 but you really don't have much to complain about.
Think of those 360 owners who've bought 2-4 360's. MS has that good warranty b/c they have a defective system. I mean think about it..would you rather pay 180 for a new ps3 or would you rather buy a new ps3 or multiple 360's?
You may want to look up more info about your HDD b/c you can recover all those files and put them on a new HDD
"Thanks for the info. Sorry to hear that your PS3 got stolen. Isn't there some way to track your stolen PS3 when it logs on to the PSN, like an IP address."
Thanks, we're getting a security system tomorrow 🙂
My understanding is that Sony Cust Serv wont get involved with tracking the console if it's stolen. Kind of annoying, but I can also understand why they'd have that policy.